Stream.Transcripts/twitch/2481471368,2481490150 (2025-06-09) - Huberman does Jayanta -- (9 June 2025)/2481471368,2481490150 (2025-06-09) - Huberman does Jayanta -- (9 June 2025).vtt

WEBVTT

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Testing 1, 2.

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Test 1, 2.

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Testing 1, 2.

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I don't know if this is in sync or not.

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This feels bad to me.

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How's it look left hand?

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Are we okay?

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All good, he says.

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All right.

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Well, let's start this thing then.

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I'm going to put myself a little bit smaller down here.

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Welcome to the show, ladies and gentlemen.

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This is for all the marbles.

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This is for the grandchildren of Earth.

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That's why there is a fake anti-vax movement in America right now.

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It's a very diabolical little scheme that this anti-vax movement has run on us.

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It is much more complicated than vaccines just working and there being a bunch of people out there trying to grift off of a lie.

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It's actually much more complicated than that.

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Please understand clearly that the idea of endemicity is an enchantment.

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There is no biological evidence for the idea that an RNA molecule can go from

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a small concentration in a laboratory or a mud puddle or the anus of a bat, and then essentially cover the earth with its presence indefinitely.

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That's the idea of endemicity, and that cannot happen, especially with regard to RNA.

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They lied about a background, an irreducibly complex background, that they distilled down with a few nonspecific PCR tests, a few 220-odd

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PCR and lateral flow test products that are now masquerading as high-fidelity diagnostics.

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They also rolled out transfection and got away with it using placebos.

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But rest assured that the entire pandemic narrative still rests on the idea that PCR is a useful diagnostic and that when you use PCR, you can find all sorts of different kinds of ghosts.

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And that makes you a ghostbuster if you follow along with that data.

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And so we really need to wake our children up to the concept that this diagnostic methodology has not been proven by the pandemic, even though now we are moving forward with an FDA that assumes that it has.

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understand that.

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That is the main and most dangerous aspect of the mythologies that we've come to accept over the course of the pandemic, that PCR is a very high-fidelity diagnostic, not just for COVID, but for anything they point it at.

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You have to be very careful, ladies and gentlemen, because that is indeed where we are.

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And it is as simple as there being an irreducibly complex background on which they could draw any signal they wanted.

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And so they told you, hey, look, we found something.

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And what they put there, what signal they released, what signal they reported in China likely has an immunological signature they knew they could track, they knew was already bright in the background, and they used other signals that were already bright in the background, associated them with this novel virus mystery, and rolled out diagnostics that we have not looked at in retrospect to see if they had any validity at all.

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and the FDA is never gonna look back.

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And you know that, you know the FDA is never gonna look back because all of the other organizations that are involved in this will never look back because there was an anticipated rise in all cause mortality.

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a bump in the population pyramid from big families after World War II, and that bump could have been predicted to produce an overload of hospitals if we were short of beds all the time, or an overload of hospitals if NHS in the UK runs at a

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certain ceiling all the time.

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And so you can see it coming up there.

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You can see that social security and all of these budgetary items are gonna change drastically as this population ages out.

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So the question is, how do we manage it?

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Well, we're gonna take advantage of this anticipated rise in all cause mortality, and we are going to sculpt it using murder and lies.

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And by sculpting it using murder and lies, we created the graph that you see here.

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The dark red is all cause mortality year on year.

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You can see between 55 and 70,000 people every week die in America because there are 350 odd million people in America.

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And that's about 2.7 to 3 million deaths per year.

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And so in order to get 200 COVID deaths a week, you actually only need to lie.

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You actually only need to use a shitty PCR test to claim that.

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You actually only need to use a very shitty model to claim that.

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And in the meantime, nobody is usefully returning to 2020 and 21 and reevaluating how we define the pandemic and how many intentional mistakes were made there.

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Because that's the real crime.

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That's where the murder was done.

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RNA cannot pandemic.

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Intramuscular injection is dumb.

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Transfecting healthy people was always, always awful.

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And the population pyramid is real.

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And if you look up this data, you can see the problem that they were going to have in the Western world, and you can see how they are planning to manage it.

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That's why all the vaccines for adults are now just a thing.

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Whereas when you and I were younger, our parents didn't have any vaccinations for pneumonia and shingles and all these other things.

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That's nonsense.

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Just like this is nonsense.

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These people are posers.

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They are posing and they are liars.

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This is Kevin McKernan last week or this week talking about how the DEA used to chem trail fungus over cannabis fields.

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Spray stuff, you know.

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And Jicky Leaks is talking about spraying clones.

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Remember the thing that Kevin McKernan called Chemtrail retarded?

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Remember this?

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And they're working together, you see.

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This is Jiki Leakes promoting the former Research and Development Director of the Human Genome Project and likely still high ranking in this Department of Energy operation where we're on to stage three.

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And Jiki Leakes is just a guy who gets everybody to argue about Nick Hudson or Jessica Hockett or somebody else that's on the same team.

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It's all one malevolent show.

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And until you can see it, you can't show it to anybody else.

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Until you can see how you've been trapped by the right-wing media on X and these other places, you can't explain it to anybody else.

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Until you can explain how this scripted bullshit was done and why these people were put in place on Rumble and Locals and Tucker Carlson,

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why this Tommy podcast even exists, why this guy has been like a multimillionaire is just on so many podcasts.

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Why are all these billionaires starting podcasts?

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Why are these senators and directors of national intelligence starting podcasts and YouTube channels?

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Unless this is the way they plan to govern us with a theater on social media.

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and then very careful funneling of this scripted bullshit only to the people who need to see it.

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That's why my parents don't know who Jessica Rose is.

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That's why my brother doesn't know who Kevin McKernan is.

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Because that's the way social media use works.

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They see an entirely different stage on this Lollapalooza.

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And that entirely different stage also doesn't include ZDogg and Vinay Prasad and Marty McCary.

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They didn't know who those people were until a month ago.

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And now they're being told by mainstream media and their side of social media exactly who these people are.

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Well, sort of.

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Enough to know that it's obvious that something bad is happening, but the scripted bullshit will never reveal or point out the, I still can't figure out the pattern.

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I know I've ruled out Russian, Chinese, and Hmong.

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And now I'm trying to figure out if there's something else I need to rule out about what's going on here.

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But there are a couple, three countries that show up a lot.

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I mean, you could think about Persians, for example.

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There's a Persian at the head of U.S.

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Emirate.

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And I think this guy's a Persian from India.

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That guy's from India.

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The other guy over there is Egyptian English, which is also weird.

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And so we just got a lot of people with multiple passports.

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We got a lot of people who suddenly have a really developed opinion about what should happen in America and a really

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not so humble opinion about what they are capable of doing as a professional.

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It is absurd to think that Vinay Prasad actually believes that he has the professional background to guide the Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research.

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It is not ridiculous to think that he has been told he's going to be put there.

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It is not ridiculous to think that he was told he's gonna be put there and given a script and so everything will be fine.

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All you gotta do is talk your cancer shit and we will put you in front of cameras and you will make everything hum.

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Oh, I can do that.

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That makes sense.

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Just like Jay Bhattacharya doesn't honestly believe that he's got the vision necessary to run an organization like the NIH.

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He doesn't even have the professional experience to know what probably or could go on there if you change their big focus from one thing to another.

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He doesn't even understand that.

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He understands hospital economics.

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And yet these people are all in charge now and we need to be scared of this because they got there by a scripted bullshit.

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Scripted bullshit is why we accept PCR as a diagnostic standard.

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Scripted bullshit is why we accept sequencing as a high-fidelity measurement.

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Scripted bullshit from Robert Malone and Kevin McKernan is why intramuscular injection is still the best idea since buttered bread.

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And the reason why mRNA has huge military potential in everybody's mind.

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Pure RNA actually probably does, especially if you could aerosolize it.

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Pure DNA probably also does, if you could aerosolize it.

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Because you could find it with PCR and claim it was something else, causing something else, a sign of something else.

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And of course, as we know, if you use social media to tell people they're sick, a certain percentage of people will feel sick.

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And of course, Trump was definitely shot by a kid who goes to my kid's high school.

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But we don't really care about why that kid did it.

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We don't know any more about him now than we did a year ago.

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And of course, the lab leak mystery has been solved now.

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Everybody agrees, including Jay Bhattacharya, that we need to take responsibility for the lab leak.

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And so we have Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

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as Health and Human Services Secretary, and we're supposed to feel like it's a big win and fight over whether Casey means and Cali means are trained agents or not, while the FDA is destroyed from within with farmers markets and seminars about talc.

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Solving America's health problems are gonna be really complicated with a bunch of saboteurs in charge.

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brought in by a Trojan horse behind what is a wreck of a man, it seems to me, Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

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We are in big trouble, ladies and gentlemen.

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America needs help.

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Americans need to come together under the idea that the left and the right have been played as absolutely awful as each other.

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There's no good side to be on if you think one team is winning.

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If you think one team or the other team is winning, then this is the sound for you.

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because that's exactly the trap.

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That's how we got here.

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And it ain't Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

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that anybody needs to be worried about.

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But of course, everybody is worried about Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

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Everybody is really worried that Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

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is going to start killing kids or, you know, his rhetoric is going to start wrecking the country.

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The vaccine infrastructure of America is about to fall apart.

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And that's all distracting you from the fact that the CDC is still doing shit.

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Distracts you from the fact that the American government is still moving.

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There's still a lot of people being paid to do stuff.

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It's just that you're being distracted with a fight between Elon Musk and Donald Trump.

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You're being distracted by a lot of things that are 5,000 miles away instead of focusing on the fact that our very government is being undermined from within by a very elaborate stunt.

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I mean a really elaborate, multi-decade long con

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I need your help, ladies and gentlemen.

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I need your help pointing this out.

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The condition that we will not call autism, I don't like the word autism, he was vaccine damaged.

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He was neurologically damaged.

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The condition that we will not call autism, I don't like the word autism, he was vaccine damaged.

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He was neurologically damaged.

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The condition that we will not call autism, I don't like the word autism, he was vaccine damaged.

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He was neurologically damaged.

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On every slide, the first slide, I have quotes.

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And I know that you don't read them at all, because you don't need to read them to pass or get a good grade.

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But this one is pretty cool.

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The quote from Alice in Wonderland.

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One can't believe impossible things, said Alice.

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I dare say you have

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I think it should be better now.

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I hope it's better now.

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Present.

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How's it look, Christy?

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Good to see you in the chat.

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I'll just start again at the very beginning to say that this is really for all the marbles.

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This is about the grandchildren of Earth, and that is why there is a fake anti-vax movement in America, but also kind of spreading around the world under certain sections of the internet.

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And we really need to be able to see this clearly so that we can make sure that our children are not spellbound by it or by the

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the intellectually dishonest rejection of the fake anti-vax movement.

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I mean, that's what we really don't want our children to do.

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We don't want our children to think that Paul Offit and all these people are just right, or mostly right, and that the anti-vax movement is exactly as incompetent as it seems.

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Because it's not.

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It's incompetent as it seems only by design, because it's part of the same illusion that brought us the pandemic.

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The same illusion that brings us endemicity, brings us autism, and brings us pandemics.

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It's all one bad biology that's based on the idea that molecules can do things all by themselves, even with maybe an enzyme or two, and then it's all bets are off.

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And this is absurd.

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There's no biological evidence in the literature for something going endemic, nevermind an RNA molecule coated in fat.

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And so what they have done, I propose, is they took a background signal and they tricked us into using their tests.

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And by using their tests to find their ghosts, we thought we were Ghostbusters.

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And we fooled ourselves into believing that we were solving a mystery about a lab leak.

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And that illusion is only made possible by this irreducibly complex background signal and our acceptance of non-specific PCR testing.

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Otherwise, there would only be one explanation for why a bunch of more people were expected to die.

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And that we lost control of pneumonia and a few other things in the hospitals because we decided not to treat viral syndromes with antibiotics.

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and we were able to mitigate what otherwise might have been a socioeconomic disaster.

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By creating this illusion of public health needing to rescue us, creating this illusion by acting on an anticipated rise in all cause mortality, and specifically acting on it by sculpting it using murder and sophisticated lying.

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One of the main things that was done in America in 2020 and 2021 was murdering Americans to make sure that the rest of the world would believe that if they didn't lock down or hadn't locked down, that they would be experiencing the same thing that supposedly America was experiencing.

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But it was actually just murder and lies.

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and the coordinated effort of several international groups and the meddlers that run them to use this narrative, fuel this narrative, and more importantly, never allow the retrospective questioning of a novel virus and the fumbling of the ball in terms of the response, but instead thinking about it as a national security exercise that primarily was the victims were Americans.

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There were also a lot of this was happening in very specific places in very specific populations in the EU.

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One of the most egregious examples being Scotland.

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Anyway, RNA cannot pandemic.

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Intramuscular injection is not medicine.

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Transfecting healthy people should be a crime and population pyramids are definitely a problem.

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And unfortunately, I think they've been sort of managed and they will continue to be managed by the public health mythology and all of the treatments for old people and preventative treatments for old people that come as a result.

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We've lost control of our FDA.

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That is absolutely for sure.

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We have lost control of our FDA.

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And if we don't get off of social media, we will have lost our contact with reality because we will be paying attention to people that are there just to perform.

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Kevin McKernan actually doesn't matter anywhere else except for on X and maybe on Rumble.

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And Jiki Leaks definitely doesn't matter anywhere except for on X.

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And so unfortunately it's taken me and a lot of people a long time to see that these people that told us years ago that the internet and social media was a disaster and that you can't use it safely.

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We just didn't take them seriously.

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And then the pandemic hit and that's all we had.

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That's all any of us had.

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And that's why we've gotten this far.

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Our children.

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Our children, ladies and gentlemen, before the pandemic, we were told that screen time was bad.

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During the pandemic, we were told that screen time is school.

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And the same people are responsible for all of it.

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Kevin McKernan, if I have my way, should be in jail at some point in American history while I'm still alive.

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Because these people really engaged in scripted bullshit

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to make sure that real informed consent for the American public never existed.

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It still doesn't exist.

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And that lack of informed consent about what they are doing to us and how they set up the remnant streams and how they faked the PCR and how they are faking the sequencing of the virus and the pretense that this is something that started in a mud puddle, this is all criminal.

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And it is a sabotaging of the very

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ability of citizens in America to exercise their responsibility as citizens to govern themselves and to run their government.

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It's not possible if people like this are on social media and paid to pretend that they are patriots.

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This is scripted bullshit, but more importantly it is malevolent and it is criminal.

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I don't know, I'm not a lawyer, but for me, this performance here and looking back on it and realizing that it wasn't just by accident, but it was scripted, that they had planned all along to do this.

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That's why in the early videos, Vinay is so uncomfortable.

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And now Vinay is so confident.

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It's not because over the last five years, he's grown up so much.

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It's because he understands that this scripted bullshit is gonna get him somewhere.

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Here, he was just recently told that that's the plan.

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He was just recently told that that's coming, you know, that there's a thing.

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Here, he's much more confident.

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In 2024, he's much more confident, because he knows what's about to come.

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He knows where he's going.

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And America might've been better off without the FDA, but heck, I'll head CBER, no problem.

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Because it's all scripted bullshit.

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We are being undermined.

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We are being sabotaged.

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And because of that sabotage, we believe that there was a lab leak.

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Almost all of the evidence for a lab leak comes from Indian sources.

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A lot of the members, the real crucial members of DRASTIC are all Indians.

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Jai Bhattacharya, Vinay Prasad,

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Kash Patel, Rochelle Walensky, Murthy.

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These are all Indians, all overseeing the orchestration of this event.

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The only Chinese person that I can really think of is Liana Wen, and she's not really doing anything.

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She's certainly not in government.

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We have a Turkish guy at the head of CMS.

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We have an Englishman at the head of the FDA.

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We have a Indian at the head of NIH.

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This is unprecedented, in my humble opinion, in a country like America with so many patriots, so many lifelong dedicated servers of our government, and they chose them?

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who for all practical purposes are book authors and podcasters.

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Solving America's health problems are going to be very, very complicated because R.F.K.

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Jr.

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as Secretary of Health and Human Services is not the end of the game.

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It's not a touchdown and now it's over and we run into the locker room and pop champagne.

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That's what they made everybody believe.

24:30.018 --> 24:34.301
I think that's what Brian Hooker believed that up until very recently.

24:34.341 --> 24:36.543
I don't think he can possibly believe it anymore.

24:41.232 --> 24:49.476
Maybe they think that Bobby was played and they feel bad for Bobby, but that would really be a sad interpretation of what's going on.

24:50.756 --> 25:04.582
Because the way to really explain this is that this has been a plan for a very long time to put Bobby Kennedy forward as a sort of a leader of Lemmings.

25:04.862 --> 25:09.164
As Peter Hotez explained in that podcast we watched a couple of days ago,

25:10.379 --> 25:16.945
It's one of the few things that could reunite the far left and the far right is anti-vax, health freedom.

25:18.286 --> 25:29.737
And you don't think that Steve Bannon took note of that, took note of the 6 million votes that autism apparently swayed with just 90 billboards with Polly Tommy in her bra.

25:31.650 --> 25:45.275
You don't think that he saw that and said to his friend, Tony Lyons, hey, let's get a book out there with a narrative out there where Bobby Kennedy runs as an independent and then joins up with one of the other candidates and they win.

25:46.156 --> 25:47.976
And then that other candidate gets shot.

25:48.056 --> 25:50.377
So Bobby Kennedy is our president.

25:50.437 --> 25:55.059
How about we write a book like that, like a book with an epilogue like that?

25:55.099 --> 25:56.159
Who could we do that with?

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Maybe, oh yeah, that guy who was the governor of Minnesota.

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Let's do it with him.

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That was in 2008.

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Now they're telling you a story about a kid from my kid's high school shot at Donald Trump an hour north of my house.

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He lives four blocks up the street on my dog walk.

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But we don't know anything more about them.

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No more about his internet history, nothing.

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We haven't figured out anything really.

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It's okay.

26:29.948 --> 26:31.049
Donald Trump doesn't care.

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He doesn't get revenge on kids, even if they shoot at him.

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Anyway, it's a big joke to me at this point that any Americans actually take what they see on social media seriously, haven't just followed along with the narrative and at some point said, wow, this book is getting dumb.

26:51.573 --> 27:00.721
Wow, that guy wearing three pens in his shirt and pretending to be some kind of working class dude when he's worked at Goldman Sachs is kind of dumb.

27:02.302 --> 27:12.851
This guy over here pretending that somehow he suffered as a persecuted academic when he settled for half a million dollars is kind of dumb.

27:13.973 --> 27:33.563
That guy up there posing as a emu farmer, horse breeder turned career burning patriot came off the retired bench to save the world and has been touring the world for six years because he just loves kids or loves America or loves the future or something.

27:35.164 --> 27:36.185
That's absurd.

27:38.291 --> 27:55.428
The idea that Kevin McKernan is somehow just a guy who, after working for the Human Genome Project for a little while, spinning off a few companies, he's decided to use the rest of his life or invest in pot genomes because that's just what he likes.

27:55.468 --> 27:57.249
He's just passionate about that stuff.

27:58.055 --> 28:09.343
And then at the start of the pandemic, he was bitching about the FDA and making fun of EUA paperwork, saying that the FDA was in the way because that's just how he feels as a pot guy.

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It doesn't have anything to do with anything else.

28:11.744 --> 28:16.808
It's just, I know from, you know, being a pot guy that the FDA is in the way.

28:16.848 --> 28:20.232
And I mean, all we really need are PCR tests.

28:20.292 --> 28:34.345
And so we're just supposed to believe that this guy got together with Claire Craig of the 100,000 Genomes Project and Mike Yeadon, formerly of Pfizer, and with some guy by the name of, what is his name?

28:35.266 --> 28:49.898
Bobby Mahaltra, from Germany, and just wrote a paper about how there's primer dimers and stuff, and there's a different way to do PCR, and the WHO paper was not properly peer-reviewed, yada yada yada.

28:50.398 --> 28:56.403
That was just him being a patriot, doing what he thought was the smartest thing to do at the time in September of 2020.

28:58.905 --> 29:00.506
That this is just all absurd.

29:00.946 --> 29:03.768
All of that, that is just absurd.

29:03.968 --> 29:14.935
It's just as absurd as thinking that Aaron Siri, formerly of Goldman Sachs, is really trying to save people from vaccine injury or get justice for them.

29:16.656 --> 29:17.957
It's just all a big lie.

29:18.397 --> 29:27.883
The biggest lie right now to understand is Robert Malone saying that we have to get the COVID shot off of the CICP and onto the VICP.

29:29.261 --> 29:39.809
We've got to move the PrEP Act forward, you know, because as long as the COVID shot stays under the PrEP Act, CICP, then we can't really sue for these vaccine damages.

29:39.869 --> 29:48.596
So the way to get justice for the people who were injured by the COVID vaccine is to move them from under the PrEP Act to under the VICP.

29:49.917 --> 29:53.540
So that all the lawyers that run those things can charge all the fees they want.

29:53.600 --> 29:56.843
That's the main reason why Aaron Seery can never tell you.

29:57.628 --> 30:03.092
that the VICP and the whole idea of that administrative kangaroo court is actually unconstitutional.

30:03.572 --> 30:05.974
They can't tell you that because they use it.

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They haven't been advising clients for a long time that that's the way for them to get their due process to their get their, you know, their their justice.

30:18.106 --> 30:24.490
And the one thing about the vaccine court that you need to understand is that interim fees are paid on both sides.

30:24.570 --> 30:25.751
Listen to that carefully.

30:26.211 --> 30:39.820
Interim fees are paid, which means that unlike any other case that Aaron Siri could take as a lawyer, unlike any other case that Aaron Siri could take as a lawyer, where he would need to win first,

30:41.926 --> 30:48.272
He would need to win first before he could charge fees to the other side or to the court or however that works.

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If you're putting cases before the VICP, you get to charge for your time as you go.

30:59.683 --> 31:04.168
And that exists nowhere else in the United States government.

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No, it's really true.

31:08.055 --> 31:12.161
It's really true, that exists nowhere else in the laws of the United States.

31:12.241 --> 31:19.892
The only place where lawyers get paid, whether they win or lose, before they win or lose, is for the VICP.

31:22.202 --> 31:26.305
So now you could think maybe that Goldman Sachs lawyer isn't so dumb after all.

31:26.365 --> 31:32.690
Maybe he's got this all cornered and he knows him and his buddies all know that this is a racket that'll never go away.

31:32.750 --> 31:50.963
And now with COVID coming, if we could get it shifted to the VICP, I mean, class action, they're seeing millions of dollars and yes, there are people on the bottom of this pyramid who are motivated by money because they see money as power or at least money as freedom.

31:52.543 --> 31:59.547
And so if you don't have millions of dollars and you're offered the chance to make millions of dollars, individuals will make those choices.

32:00.108 --> 32:11.114
But to think that ultimately this whole charade was done by pharmaceutical companies or done by the DoD, it's just absurd.

32:12.035 --> 32:17.018
This screen alone tells you that it wasn't the DoD killing Americans.

32:20.444 --> 32:23.925
This screen alone tells you that it's much more complicated than that.

32:26.105 --> 32:32.887
The fact that nobody talks about Tony Bark or Brandy Vaughn, it tells you it's a lot more complicated than that.

32:36.767 --> 32:44.689
So I want to watch this Restoring Trust in Science and Health with Dr. Jay Yanta Bhattacharya and Huberman.

32:45.709 --> 32:47.830
But first I'm going to run the intro and

32:49.082 --> 32:53.224
and give you a couple other examples from the goofiness before we get to this one.

32:53.304 --> 32:54.464
So just stay tuned.

32:54.504 --> 32:55.165
I'll be right back.

32:56.545 --> 33:00.287
The VICP is, sorry, I'll just answer that question.

33:00.787 --> 33:04.489
The VICP is the vaccine court before COVID.

33:05.273 --> 33:10.336
The VICP is where like Ralph Hazelhurst's case was.

33:11.597 --> 33:16.861
Anytime you were injured by a vaccine before the pandemic, you would have had to go to the VICP.

33:16.901 --> 33:21.884
And that I believe is under the National Vaccine, something, you know, Immunization Act, something like that.

33:22.885 --> 33:24.266
You have to, I'm not a lawyer.

33:24.326 --> 33:31.511
So, you know, there's some things I'm gonna get a little bit off from which law it is or whatever, but that was before and that's independent of the PrEP Act.

33:31.531 --> 33:33.172
The VICP, I think is that one.

33:34.073 --> 33:34.333
Anyway.

33:35.427 --> 33:36.148
Here we go.

33:37.651 --> 33:38.773
Yes, I'll be back in a second

33:42.069 --> 33:44.751
A condition that we will not call autism.

33:44.911 --> 33:46.453
I don't like the word autism.

33:47.353 --> 33:48.394
He was vaccine damaged.

33:48.754 --> 33:50.195
He was neurologically damaged.

33:50.796 --> 33:53.618
A condition that we will not call autism.

33:53.778 --> 33:55.319
I don't like the word autism.

33:56.220 --> 33:57.261
He was vaccine damaged.

33:57.621 --> 33:59.042
He was neurologically damaged.

33:59.803 --> 34:02.485
A condition that we will not call autism.

34:02.645 --> 34:04.186
I don't like the word autism.

34:05.087 --> 34:06.108
He was vaccine damaged.

34:08.105 --> 34:10.646
On every slide, the first slide, I have quotes.

34:10.686 --> 34:16.328
And I know that you don't read them at all, because you don't need to read them to pass or get a good grade.

34:16.588 --> 34:17.628
But this one is pretty cool.

34:17.988 --> 34:20.729
The quote from Alice in Wonderland.

34:21.449 --> 34:24.710
One can't believe impossible things, said Alice.

34:25.330 --> 34:27.791
I dare say you haven't had much practice, said the queen.

34:27.831 --> 34:32.813
Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast.

34:33.113 --> 34:35.553
So that's totally suitable for this lecture.

34:35.573 --> 34:37.434
A lot of impossible things are going to happen.

34:39.182 --> 34:41.885
a condition that we will not call autism.

34:42.025 --> 34:43.587
I don't like the word autism.

34:44.207 --> 34:45.488
Um, he was vaccine damaged.

34:45.508 --> 34:51.314
I think, but you can tell if someone's lying, you know, you can sort of feel it in people.

34:53.116 --> 34:53.817
And I have lied.

34:53.837 --> 34:54.878
I'm sure I'll lie again.

34:54.898 --> 34:55.819
I don't want to lie.

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You know, I don't think I'm a liar.

34:57.781 --> 34:58.802
I try not to be a liar.

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I don't want to be a liar.

35:00.243 --> 35:02.966
I think it's like really important not to be a liar.

35:11.998 --> 35:14.900
But you can tell if someone's lying, you know, you can sort of feel it in people.

35:39.329 --> 35:40.029
And I have lied.

35:40.049 --> 35:41.089
I'm sure I'll lie again.

35:41.109 --> 35:42.050
I don't want to lie.

35:42.550 --> 35:43.890
You know, I don't think I'm a liar.

35:43.990 --> 35:45.010
I try not to be a liar.

35:45.050 --> 35:45.891
I don't want to be a liar.

35:46.471 --> 35:49.231
I think it's like really important not to be a liar.

35:54.693 --> 36:03.495
One thing I am confident of from everything I've read is that this RNA exists, you can capture it, you can sequence it, you can move it to other cells and recapitulate disease.

36:07.449 --> 36:20.355
It doesn't matter much at all what you believe about vaccines until we invent really important ones, until we have a pandemic that's killing everyone, and it's measles plus.

36:20.455 --> 36:25.977
Okay, I can tolerate what you think about measles, because not that many people die from it.

36:26.277 --> 36:28.218
It's just a big hassle in the end.

36:31.360 --> 36:44.570
when we have this new pandemic that is, you know, got 75% mortality and it's not, it's, there'll be no pretense of being polite in the face of these beliefs.

36:44.630 --> 36:47.131
It'll be a moral emergency because it has to be.

36:53.883 --> 36:59.025
insistence, and I think he's right, on calling them transfections rather than vaccines.

36:59.785 --> 37:00.266
Actually, J.J.

37:00.306 --> 37:06.928
Cooey's insistence, and I think he's right, on calling them transfections rather than vaccines.

37:07.709 --> 37:08.209
Actually, J.J.

37:08.229 --> 37:14.872
Cooey's insistence, and I think he's right, on calling them transfections rather than vaccines.

37:19.633 --> 37:21.934
Yes, testing, test, test, testing.

37:22.074 --> 37:23.255
Test one, two, test.

37:29.676 --> 37:50.133
I don't care how you get there.

37:50.153 --> 37:52.835
I don't care what you do to get there.

37:52.855 --> 37:55.397
The goal is to win.

38:00.214 --> 38:01.134
What time is it?

38:01.194 --> 38:02.315
Game time!

38:08.396 --> 38:09.577
Alright, good morning.

38:10.497 --> 38:12.237
Haven't heard any chords in a while.

38:12.297 --> 38:13.238
Boy, that's rough.

38:13.298 --> 38:14.338
That hits me hard.

38:14.538 --> 38:17.139
That hits me right in the feels, man.

38:17.979 --> 38:19.640
You haven't heard any chords in a while.

38:19.660 --> 38:25.121
I haven't been practicing, so it's like every time I pick it up, I'm just rehearsing what I already know.

38:25.141 --> 38:27.782
I haven't added the last bit of chords to peg yet.

38:28.462 --> 38:32.344
So maybe I need to get it, maybe I need to get it going again.

38:32.404 --> 38:33.405
Thank you for that plug.

38:34.385 --> 38:37.627
Ladies and gentlemen, I'm trying to encourage people to get off social media.

38:37.667 --> 38:39.448
At least stop using it skillfully.

38:40.228 --> 38:47.152
If you want to go there and mess it up, you want to go there and read some stuff or follow a few people like me and retweet it.

38:47.392 --> 38:48.713
We will not call autism.

38:48.873 --> 38:50.434
I don't like the word autism.

38:51.314 --> 38:52.215
He was vaccine damaged.

38:52.355 --> 38:53.776
Brian, Brian, Brian, it's okay.

38:53.857 --> 38:55.138
I already told them.

38:55.778 --> 38:58.761
Intramuscular injection is never questioned as a methodology.

38:59.182 --> 39:02.205
Making sure that virology is never questioned as a science.

39:02.345 --> 39:05.208
Making sure public health is never questioned as a reason.

39:05.248 --> 39:09.952
That's what autism spectrum disorder as a mythology is able to accomplish.

39:10.373 --> 39:12.675
That's also what the pandemics and gain-of-function

39:13.095 --> 39:18.040
We're also meant to reinforce, making sure that we would pass this down to our children.

39:18.801 --> 39:21.604
And we need to understand that trap and make sure we don't do it.

39:21.644 --> 39:24.768
The cheese is free on social media and there's a good reason why.

39:26.810 --> 39:28.251
Very, very excited to be here.

39:28.271 --> 39:30.434
This is a busy day, busy week.

39:31.194 --> 39:44.357
Mark Kulak has done some really crackin' work, and it's really just brought together a lot of loose ends in my mind, make me feel a lot better about the path that I've taken and where I find myself now.

39:44.877 --> 39:51.839
So we are gonna focus on Huberman doing Jayanta, but first we will, yeah, we're gonna

39:53.362 --> 39:59.346
We're going to roll through a couple other videos, which I want to use as examples for what's going on here.

39:59.386 --> 40:00.067
Welcome to the show.

40:00.087 --> 40:04.630
This is an American stream coming to you live from Pittsburgh in America.

40:04.690 --> 40:11.075
And so, yes, it's primarily a message for Americans because this is where the whole nonsense started.

40:11.095 --> 40:13.317
So if you've been here for a while, you're at the top of the wave.

40:13.397 --> 40:20.142
If not, you might be a skilled social media user that needs to learn to stay focused on the biology, not to take the bait on social media.

40:20.802 --> 40:29.386
And to start loving your real neighbors, the people that you are in contact with, you call, that you see, that you share your community with.

40:30.126 --> 40:36.169
And community doesn't mean a random group of people based on some random attribute, but it means the people you live with.

40:37.090 --> 40:39.271
Ladies and gentlemen, my name is Jonathan Couey.

40:39.291 --> 40:41.412
I'm Chief Biologist at Dingo Home Biological.

40:41.592 --> 40:46.975
I have a YouTube channel called JC on a Bike, which I'm not streaming on right now, but JC in the Woods is also me.

40:48.035 --> 40:50.317
And although I didn't edit it, it should be live now.

40:50.357 --> 40:51.398
If it's not, it doesn't matter.

40:51.798 --> 40:54.720
Because I'm also on Twitch, I'm also on PeerTube, I'm also on Rumble.

40:55.901 --> 40:59.384
You can support the work if you go to GigaOM Biological.

40:59.444 --> 41:03.146
The way it works is that... Now, why is that not playing?

41:04.908 --> 41:05.948
That's super annoying.

41:06.048 --> 41:07.570
I don't really know what's up.

41:07.650 --> 41:10.312
My computer is just not very happy with me lately.

41:10.352 --> 41:11.893
Maybe I have too much on my desktop.

41:12.573 --> 41:17.077
And once I clear that off... I have considered live streaming on X. That does cost money.

41:18.190 --> 41:20.591
I don't know if I want to support that platform.

41:20.631 --> 41:23.232
I think that platform is one of the reasons why we are here.

41:23.952 --> 41:27.594
Ladies and gentlemen, my website is GigaOMBiological.com.

41:27.714 --> 41:39.358
The most important link there, other than support GigaOM, is that stuff link because that's where I'm going to be putting the stuff that we're writing together, the stuff that we're working on, and of course anything that you need to download.

41:39.418 --> 41:43.820
Right now the main thing to download, if you haven't downloaded it, is the McKinsey Report about Population.

41:44.860 --> 41:47.321
There you can see some of the links to help sponsor the show.

41:47.421 --> 41:54.843
I thank you very much to all the people that do so and yeah, that's That's a really only possible.

41:54.903 --> 42:11.307
This whole thing is only really possible because I've had at least one Person along with me all the way and that is Housatonic live Mark Kulak out of Boston, Massachusetts at housatonicits.com He's on twitch rumble odyssey and and and bit shoot.

42:11.447 --> 42:13.388
I think he's even got a bit shoot hat because he

42:14.088 --> 42:15.170
He posts there so much.

42:16.231 --> 42:19.396
Independent bright web is what I'm trying to recruit for.

42:19.496 --> 42:29.570
And that just means people who are basically one man, one lady shows, you know, a family, somebody that's just trying to get the real truth out as an American.

42:30.471 --> 42:39.774
And an independent bright web is how we're going to save America, I think, because we need an alternative media that we can feel comfortable sharing with our family and friends directly via email.

42:39.834 --> 42:41.494
I hope that I'm providing that to you.

42:42.734 --> 42:49.356
Remember that PeerTube, where I'm also streaming and also archiving all of this work, allows downloading.

42:49.396 --> 42:56.418
The primary intention of PeerTube is to allow you to download those videos so you can watch them offline and you can do something with them.

42:56.518 --> 42:57.799
I don't know what you want to do with them.

42:57.819 --> 42:58.999
You can just send them to people.

42:59.039 --> 42:59.499
You can just

43:00.049 --> 43:01.730
make your own YouTube channel with them.

43:01.770 --> 43:04.051
You could cut clips, you can do whatever you want.

43:04.631 --> 43:07.952
And the point is to get you off of regular social media.

43:07.973 --> 43:27.081
I don't want YouTube to be able to put ads in front of you and I don't want YouTube to be able to show you these performers because YouTube is a place where you can go down a lot of different places, a lot of different staircases and find yourself in the middle of a bunch of performers with elaborate costumes and effects all in the same script.

43:28.084 --> 43:30.807
And so I want to get people off of those platforms.

43:30.847 --> 43:36.072
If you go to PeerTube, you are going to find me or you are going to find Mark.

43:36.292 --> 43:37.373
And that's really it.

43:38.414 --> 43:39.576
These people have fooled us.

43:39.696 --> 43:41.518
Ladies and gentlemen, I feel very comfortable.

43:42.078 --> 43:49.305
I feel very comfortable saying from between two phages that these people are all part of a malevolent network on a

43:50.672 --> 43:57.980
I would say Robert Malone, Kevin McKernan provided script, although I'm definitely open to the idea that there are authors out there that I'm not aware of.

43:58.861 --> 44:01.764
There's a lot of people that would be capable of writing this script.

44:02.265 --> 44:08.171
And some of the best examples of people who have been on this provided script since the beginning of the pandemic,

44:08.892 --> 44:19.901
I include Andrew Kaufman, Tom Cowan, and Mark and Sam Bailey, as well as, of course, Kevin McCairn, Mr. Worst Case Scenario out of Tokyo, both in 2020 and in 2024.

44:20.081 --> 44:23.924
And the cute thing about this clown is that in 2020, he was working with

44:34.873 --> 44:43.356
The Associates of George Webb, which ties him right directly to Robert Malone, ties you right directly to 60 Minutes.

44:43.516 --> 44:51.438
It ties you right directly to the illusion of a lab leak, or a military attack, or an intentional release.

44:52.017 --> 44:56.638
And all of these narratives are necessary in order for that mystery to catch on.

44:57.059 --> 45:14.804
And the only real refuge that you had from the mystery of a lab leak were these other posers that were just telling you that there are no viruses at all, but then not able to get to the logical conclusion, then that must mean that the vaccine schedule, especially the one in America, is really, really bad.

45:15.643 --> 45:25.646
But of course, they didn't have that message in 2020 or 2021, even though Tom Cowan had that message in 2018 in a Chelsea Green book.

45:27.927 --> 45:44.873
So at the beginning of the pandemic, Tom Cowan decided to razor focus on the idea that there are no viruses, and razor focus on the idea that they can't isolate them, and razor focus on the idea they can't culture them, and razor focus on the idea that they can't purify them.

45:45.680 --> 45:49.282
And that they use these terms incorrectly so much that it's obviously fake.

45:49.782 --> 45:54.485
But then never explains to people, that's why I wrote a book in 2018.

45:55.165 --> 45:58.267
And that's why I think the vaccine schedule is criminal.

45:58.327 --> 45:59.528
But they don't say that.

46:00.988 --> 46:03.570
Because they're just as fake as Mary Holland.

46:03.950 --> 46:05.871
They're just as fake as Pauly Tommy.

46:06.311 --> 46:08.613
It's all part of the same show.

46:10.594 --> 46:12.235
And so when you see this guy,

46:13.448 --> 46:28.054
you see what he's done, and you see that none other than Steve Kirsch tried to send me there in 2022 to work with him on hamster experiments, and now they're promoting him with the Human Genome Project, former Research and Development Director.

46:28.715 --> 46:31.336
Now they're promoting him opposite Jordan Vaughan.

46:31.836 --> 46:33.977
Now they're promoting him like they promote

46:34.844 --> 46:38.606
all of them including now Pierre Cory who's blowing the lid off of SIDS.

46:39.147 --> 46:45.170
Why didn't ICANN and CHD blow the lid off of SIDS like a decade ago?

46:51.053 --> 46:52.314
It's because it's by design.

46:54.968 --> 46:57.150
to descend into madness.

46:57.671 --> 46:59.993
I mean, and it's been slow.

47:00.694 --> 47:02.455
So this is 2024.

47:02.716 --> 47:07.200
This is, of course, one of the intellectual dark web mirrors.

47:08.322 --> 47:19.085
There's several of these, like Tim Poole is one of them, this guy's one of them, there's a lot of them that basically agree to argue about intellectual dark web people to make them relevant.

47:19.165 --> 47:26.006
So if you make fun of the Rubin Report or you make fun of Brett Weinstein, you're still making him relevant.

47:27.727 --> 47:32.208
And so I'm trying very hard not to cover him anymore because that makes him relevant.

47:33.407 --> 47:38.308
But these guys will cover him, and I need you to see how we've been set up.

47:38.368 --> 47:59.573
Because while we are insulated in our own little social media bubble over here, in our own boycott of PBS NewsHour, we don't know what people on the opposite side of the internet are seeing and listening to, and how easy it is to make fun of what, for all practical purposes, is our side of the narrative.

48:00.936 --> 48:04.757
And if you see it that way, you'll understand why I think America is in really big trouble.

48:04.817 --> 48:07.857
And I think we need to wake up and apologize for being here.

48:08.317 --> 48:12.518
It's our fault because we bought into this fake health freedom movement.

48:12.598 --> 48:14.638
And now we are open to ridicule.

48:16.719 --> 48:29.901
Dissent or I mean, I should I should say he's been on it for a long time and but here is Bill Maher with his, you know,

48:30.879 --> 49:00.175
non-anti- so bill maher is part of this right bill maher presents this supposedly rational middle ground that there is no rational middle ground there's no rational middle ground on so many things right now and that's by design and then there are a bunch of things that we're supposed to think there's no rational middle ground are that are completely irrelevant you know like epstein you're just supposed to believe you're supposed to have an opinion

49:02.932 --> 49:03.633
And it's irrelevant.

49:04.714 --> 49:05.834
It's worse than irrelevant.

49:07.216 --> 49:08.697
Anti-vax, anti-vaxism.

49:09.938 --> 49:15.402
He's on with Seth MacFarlane, the guy from Family Guy, who supported Bernie.

49:15.443 --> 49:18.125
So, you know, seems like he has decent politics.

49:18.465 --> 49:19.366
He has decent politics.

49:19.406 --> 49:21.067
You don't need to have decent politics.

49:21.127 --> 49:22.228
Decent politics.

49:22.308 --> 49:24.890
Remember that both of these people have their SAG card.

49:24.930 --> 49:26.492
That's the first thing to understand.

49:28.041 --> 49:29.242
I don't have a SAG card.

49:29.542 --> 49:30.883
Mark doesn't have a SAG card.

49:31.324 --> 49:42.793
These people are professional actors in a union that would potentially allow them to get a TV show or a movie or to be an extra in a movie.

49:42.873 --> 49:44.234
And maybe they're doing that too.

49:46.471 --> 49:48.413
Understand that very, very clearly.

49:49.193 --> 49:52.476
These are wannabe professional actors, first and foremost.

49:52.716 --> 49:56.840
Otherwise, they wouldn't have a SAG card and they would call themselves journalists, but they do not.

49:57.520 --> 49:58.461
This is entertainment.

49:59.161 --> 49:59.642
Politics.

50:00.442 --> 50:08.529
To understand the basic functioning of vaccinations and... A lot of squares that aren't socialists get it too.

50:08.709 --> 50:09.190
Yeah.

50:09.290 --> 50:14.334
Quite frankly, I don't think Brett Weinstein calls himself a journalist or anything like that either.

50:16.221 --> 50:19.704
I would like to start calling myself a junior analyst and a coach.

50:20.385 --> 50:34.617
I don't think I'm an analyst if Mark Kulak is an analyst, but from a biological perspective, from my own personal professional expertise, I feel like I could call myself an analyst.

50:35.453 --> 50:36.614
And let's be clear.

50:36.634 --> 50:48.081
I mean, if you look at the numbers, it's very, very hard to really get a sense of just what's going on with COVID at this point, because the CDC is not even tracking this stuff in any type of like daily manner.

50:48.101 --> 50:54.024
Now, the reason why I'm playing it is because I want you to hear what the narrative was right before the election.

50:54.124 --> 51:01.729
So right before all of this stuff turned over to Donald Trump, these guys were talking about Bill Maher

51:02.689 --> 51:10.153
and Seth MacFarlane talking about vaccines and misinformation and making fun of Bill Maher, of course.

51:10.393 --> 51:10.733
Anymore.

51:11.474 --> 51:14.655
And they haven't for over a year, well over a year now.

51:16.016 --> 51:16.797
But there's a spike.

51:17.457 --> 51:18.277
There's a big spike.

51:19.518 --> 51:23.400
And we still lose about 200 people a day to COVID.

51:28.741 --> 51:33.985
Remember what I said now, we lose between 50,000 and 70,000 per week.

51:35.346 --> 51:46.935
So with disingenuous use of a non-specific PCR test as a gold standard alone, you can now have a disease circulating in the background with 200 cases?

51:47.035 --> 51:47.295
Really?

51:47.315 --> 51:49.056
200 deaths?

51:49.256 --> 51:49.577
Really?

51:49.597 --> 51:52.179
A little bit higher than that right now.

51:53.457 --> 52:04.080
And people forget that the biggest fear at the beginning of this was that our hospital systems would be overwhelmed.

52:04.140 --> 52:08.801
And they certainly were right on the brink, particularly like in New York for a couple.

52:08.941 --> 52:11.362
Right on the brink of being completely empty.

52:13.582 --> 52:17.083
And they emptied them using dexamethasone, according to Robert Malone.

52:17.883 --> 52:20.564
And so again, remember this, you know the truth.

52:21.786 --> 52:31.475
You know how this is not at all what happened, but I need you to see that there is an orchestrated symphony of content creators.

52:32.636 --> 52:38.481
This is a four person show with a producer and clips and everything, and a set.

52:38.561 --> 52:45.488
This guy's been in social media and was actually worked at an organization where Robert F. Kennedy worked 10 years ago.

52:52.403 --> 53:07.800
And so this is really all one malevolent show, even if they're not wittingly, if this one or somebody else is not wittingly aware of Sam's conflicts of interest with regard to Bobby, I don't know what to say.

53:08.260 --> 53:08.801
But this is...

53:10.660 --> 53:11.660
This is one show.

53:12.160 --> 53:13.641
It is one show on the internet.

53:14.041 --> 53:22.283
It is one show that agrees to make the other half of the show relevant by, you know, cutting on them or critiquing them.

53:22.303 --> 53:32.385
You know, in March of 2020, where you had to have refrigerated 18 wheelers to stack all the bodies there.

53:33.625 --> 53:39.667
And we seem to have basically settled into where COVID is going to be endemic.

53:41.225 --> 53:47.427
and we put a- Refrigerated 18 wheelers and now we've just settled into COVID being endemic.

53:47.507 --> 53:50.048
So this guy understands that term very well.

53:50.789 --> 53:54.270
And I hope you can see why I'm accentuating that.

53:54.370 --> 53:56.831
He understands that term very, very well.

53:58.371 --> 53:59.532
And that's by design.

53:59.872 --> 54:01.052
He's scripted.

54:01.133 --> 54:02.553
This is scripted bullshit.

54:03.753 --> 54:05.254
Looks like it's gonna be endemic.

54:06.294 --> 54:07.575
Says this super clown.

54:13.732 --> 54:23.035
up with 80 flu deaths a day and now we'll put up with, I don't know, about 200 COVID deaths per day.

54:26.397 --> 54:29.958
We have also this... Do you see what PCR would allow to happen?

54:31.084 --> 54:42.735
PCR disingenuously applied to an irreducibly complex background could cause the instant spread of anything, the instant presence of anything in the background.

54:42.795 --> 54:53.585
And here, they're even probably just using modeling from a very small data set to try and claim that there are so many deaths per day or per week or whatever he said.

54:53.805 --> 54:56.427
Sort of third element now, RSV,

54:58.752 --> 54:59.693
respiratory virus.

54:59.733 --> 55:08.883
It's unclear, you know, what COVID has done to our immune systems that we have this sort of like third now threat.

55:11.086 --> 55:13.909
But we have yet to sort of step up and

55:16.084 --> 55:25.467
except that these things are real, like even the flu we accept is more real than covid across the population.

55:25.607 --> 55:27.528
Well, that's because more people get flu shots.

55:27.588 --> 55:27.948
Yeah.

55:27.988 --> 55:32.630
Bill Maher has heard of flu, had heard of the flu growing up, but covid was a new thing.

55:32.650 --> 55:33.390
Well, let's be careful.

55:33.430 --> 55:36.671
Bill Maher also said flu shots were bullshit in 2015.

55:36.831 --> 55:38.472
And he said it on this too.

55:38.632 --> 55:39.552
Oh, OK.

55:39.592 --> 55:42.073
He's a long he's an OG anti actually.

55:43.094 --> 55:50.459
Flu shots, we have known, they vary in efficacy from year to year based upon what the flu strand is.

55:50.900 --> 56:04.150
We are in that stage with COVID where we don't know how to predict which strand of COVID is going to exist because- It's a magnificent level of certainty coming from a value entertainment kind of person, right?

56:04.930 --> 56:09.615
It's a spectacular level of certainty that he's explaining this biology.

56:09.675 --> 56:13.319
It's a very simple, ridiculous level of certainty.

56:14.680 --> 56:15.902
It continues to mutate.

56:17.744 --> 56:20.667
And we do know that even if

56:21.914 --> 56:38.307
The strand of the flu that we vaccinate for isn't the one that is predicted or is different enough so that it can't inhibit your ability to get it, or it inhibits your ability to get it, but it doesn't fully prevent it.

56:38.647 --> 56:39.948
People understand that difference, right?

56:43.698 --> 56:52.324
reduce the chances of me getting into a car accident on my bicycle, but not eliminate it.

56:53.065 --> 57:00.790
I can reduce it by maybe dropping my speed and by following the traffic laws, but I can't get rid of the danger of it.

57:01.110 --> 57:06.654
I can also mitigate the implications of getting into that accident by wearing a helmet.

57:07.575 --> 57:12.759
And if I wanted to wear, you know, I don't know, elbow pads and knee pads, that could also mitigate

57:13.726 --> 57:15.147
the nature of the injury.

57:15.868 --> 57:25.474
I can tell you from being an actual biker and not somebody who's just bullshitting around that the only thing you really need to wear besides a helmet are wrist guards.

57:26.155 --> 57:32.799
You know, the ones that don't let your wrist bend because that's the only real danger when you crash your bike is breaking your wrist.

57:33.520 --> 57:35.281
I mean, you're going to scratch your elbows up.

57:35.301 --> 57:36.582
You're going to bump your knees up.

57:36.682 --> 57:36.942
Having

57:37.981 --> 57:46.605
Wearing pads on your elbows and wearing pads on your knees every day, all the time for the one time that you might crash every year is ridiculous.

57:47.526 --> 57:53.149
And I crashed, I crashed three times in the four years that I was riding to the University of Pittsburgh.

57:53.289 --> 58:01.913
Once on a car, once in front of a car, twice I think really I kind of crashed because I used my front brake and it was too good and my back brake wasn't.

58:02.033 --> 58:05.255
And that's just me and my poor bicycle maintenance.

58:06.257 --> 58:09.721
But this is the kind of nonsense where we're at.

58:09.781 --> 58:20.432
This is 2024, and we're still trying to have this pseudo-intellectual conversation about what happened during the pandemic, and it all presupposes the same thing.

58:23.985 --> 58:25.326
Vaccinations work the same way.

58:25.706 --> 58:26.307
They always have.

58:27.428 --> 58:31.751
And I just say these basic things because Bill Maher's just an idiot.

58:31.951 --> 58:36.314
And what's also amazing in this, he looks like he's shrinking into his seat.

58:36.514 --> 58:39.876
This guy's literally shrinking as he talks.

58:39.956 --> 58:42.278
I mean, I just I have a few just quick points.

58:42.378 --> 58:43.318
just to observe.

58:43.879 --> 58:49.581
It just seems like every Club Random episode is just an opportunity for Bill Maher to get as messed up as possible.

58:50.001 --> 58:50.642
Drinking.

58:50.662 --> 58:53.063
Very often people who aren't doctors have been.

58:53.523 --> 58:54.964
That's why they call their colleagues.

58:55.944 --> 58:57.185
I'm not about this.

58:57.905 --> 58:59.345
That's why they call their colleagues.

58:59.386 --> 59:02.647
There's a lot of guesswork but it's educated guesswork.

59:02.867 --> 59:03.067
Yes.

59:03.227 --> 59:06.729
If you're not a doctor your guess is maybe not going to be as educated as

59:07.489 --> 59:08.289
as someone who is.

59:08.329 --> 59:10.850
But then why are doctors wrong about so much?

59:11.190 --> 59:12.631
Well, they're right about a lot, too.

59:12.911 --> 59:13.131
Yes.

59:13.231 --> 59:16.892
And but very often people who aren't doctors have been right or about things.

59:17.113 --> 59:18.273
Can you pause it for a second?

59:18.293 --> 59:21.714
Like, first of all, like doctors are wrong about things.

59:21.794 --> 59:25.055
Medical history is like medical science provisional.

59:25.496 --> 59:31.438
Usually the people determined isn't just a normal guy being like, hey, I think you're doing that like heart surgery wrong.

59:31.478 --> 59:35.099
It's other doctors being like, oh, but of course, Bill Maher is an op.

59:35.239 --> 59:37.240
Bill Maher has a giant audience.

59:37.280 --> 59:42.702
He has a giant audience in a very important voting part of the American public.

59:43.563 --> 59:45.163
And he's got a great platform.

59:46.184 --> 59:48.125
And he loves saying that he hates kids.

59:49.865 --> 59:52.326
I think Bill Maher is one of the worst Americans alive.

59:54.167 --> 59:55.368
Just to make that very clear.

59:55.628 --> 59:58.129
I think our methods can stand to improvement here.

59:58.369 --> 59:58.569
Right.

59:59.209 --> 01:00:01.550
He's just talking out of his arse, honestly.

01:00:01.590 --> 01:00:02.571
I mean, just completely.

01:00:03.607 --> 01:00:06.349
Love how the chair just seems to be growing around him though.

01:00:06.389 --> 01:00:07.410
Go ahead.

01:00:07.470 --> 01:00:10.973
But very often people who aren't doctors have been writer about things.

01:00:11.874 --> 01:00:12.034
What?

01:00:12.094 --> 01:00:13.795
Like what would be an example of that?

01:00:14.135 --> 01:00:20.360
I would think this country did not allow for natural immunity.

01:00:21.461 --> 01:00:24.504
And so now I'm trying to show you this because I need you to see it.

01:00:25.612 --> 01:00:28.573
The natural immunity argument presupposes the virus.

01:00:28.653 --> 01:00:36.735
The natural argument of immunity, the natural immunity argument presupposes antibodies are the basis for immunity.

01:00:37.535 --> 01:00:41.816
It presupposes that testing for seroprevalence is a way to measure immunity.

01:00:41.896 --> 01:00:47.097
And it suggests that you are basically gonna argue for diagnostics in a different way.

01:00:48.238 --> 01:00:49.138
And so it's a trap.

01:00:49.358 --> 01:00:52.019
It's a trap that I fell in hook, line, and sinker in 2020.

01:00:53.901 --> 01:00:55.462
I didn't see it right away.

01:00:56.182 --> 01:00:57.403
I fell right for it.

01:00:58.644 --> 01:01:05.988
And one of the guys that was primary in laying down the natural immunity narrative was Mike Eden.

01:01:06.508 --> 01:01:11.951
Another guy who was really important in laying down the natural immunity narrative was Ryan Cole.

01:01:14.112 --> 01:01:18.395
Both of whom I would consider part of the OG Team Robert Malone.

01:01:19.662 --> 01:01:23.624
To be considered, and I know this is a subject near to your heart.

01:01:23.684 --> 01:01:25.044
Pause it one second.

01:01:25.545 --> 01:01:30.947
First of all, this camera angle is just like, I don't know, like who in the world?

01:01:32.368 --> 01:01:34.789
Like what is the artistic choice?

01:01:36.629 --> 01:01:37.830
Three do that in Europe.

01:01:37.850 --> 01:01:40.091
I think they do that here.

01:01:40.111 --> 01:01:43.292
There's mandatory vaccination and grades in schools.

01:01:43.633 --> 01:01:46.194
Right, but if you already had the disease, you have natural immunity.

01:01:46.254 --> 01:01:48.995
It's not really mandatory in the Netherlands like it is here.

01:01:50.376 --> 01:01:52.937
We didn't seem to believe in that.

01:01:52.957 --> 01:01:55.098
That was debunked though.

01:01:55.158 --> 01:01:57.218
Don't you know people who've had COVID four or five times?

01:01:57.298 --> 01:01:57.558
I do.

01:01:58.018 --> 01:01:59.099
That's not natural immunity.

01:01:59.679 --> 01:02:00.459
There's no immunity there.

01:02:00.479 --> 01:02:01.620
You've had COVID five times.

01:02:02.000 --> 01:02:03.080
See, so there you go.

01:02:03.200 --> 01:02:04.881
Now you see what this is all about.

01:02:05.681 --> 01:02:08.222
And then they'll argue that it was the COVID shot that did that.

01:02:08.302 --> 01:02:09.522
No, it's the PCR.

01:02:11.483 --> 01:02:12.203
It's the testing.

01:02:13.584 --> 01:02:19.946
And it's the belief that these things, these diagnostics are high fidelity diagnostic tools when they're not.

01:02:20.006 --> 01:02:24.247
They have not been evaluated by the FDA as medical devices, not one of them.

01:02:25.187 --> 01:02:26.528
Think about that for a second.

01:02:27.928 --> 01:02:30.389
And these people aren't arguing about that at all.

01:02:30.829 --> 01:02:33.189
Marty Makary's not worried about that at all.

01:02:33.629 --> 01:02:35.630
Bobby Kennedy's not worried about that at all.

01:02:35.710 --> 01:02:38.931
I guarantee you Vinay Prasad is not worried about that at all.

01:02:38.971 --> 01:02:42.612
And if you don't wake up and apologize to your kids for not seeing it soon,

01:02:44.460 --> 01:02:45.121
We are done.

01:02:47.323 --> 01:02:48.605
It's all about this.

01:02:49.366 --> 01:02:57.815
It's all about understanding what they didn't question and what they still remain seemingly unable to question.

01:03:02.003 --> 01:03:04.186
Probably because you had too many vaccines.

01:03:04.986 --> 01:03:05.487
I didn't know.

01:03:05.787 --> 01:03:06.869
Yeah, probably.

01:03:07.249 --> 01:03:18.321
Probably now the reason why you get covered multiple times is not because natural immunity doesn't exist, but that the vaccination reverses natural immunity is what he said.

01:03:18.341 --> 01:03:19.863
It doesn't let natural immunity cook.

01:03:20.664 --> 01:03:22.026
Yeah, it's just the dumbest.

01:03:23.827 --> 01:03:28.611
But how can he be so certain it's dumb unless he's scripted to be so certain it's dumb?

01:03:28.651 --> 01:03:31.734
That's the thing that I can't understand about any of these people.

01:03:32.735 --> 01:03:48.968
It is the scripted certainty of others which makes them scriptedly certain, maybe, I don't know, but we are in a very malevolent place because if you are on Twitter arguing about Casey and Callie means, you're not aware of what they're telling everybody else in America.

01:03:49.809 --> 01:03:52.451
You're not aware of how bad it is, and it's real bad.

01:03:56.738 --> 01:04:05.124
And this is like grade school stuff, except for a grade school student would realize like, I'm really not in a position to opine about this.

01:04:05.404 --> 01:04:08.226
That's what's funny is they all think they're right about this stuff.

01:04:08.726 --> 01:04:10.747
But they're not aware that they think that too?

01:04:10.928 --> 01:04:12.168
Isn't that ridiculous?

01:04:12.369 --> 01:04:17.812
That they are also convinced that with a few short minutes on the internet, they know the truth.

01:04:17.852 --> 01:04:22.776
They've chosen the truth versus the lies, and they can see it very easy.

01:04:23.476 --> 01:04:24.637
It's remarkable.

01:04:25.609 --> 01:04:27.589
It's actually, like, extremely stupid.

01:04:27.869 --> 01:04:28.370
Stupid.

01:04:30.130 --> 01:04:32.310
Probably because you had too many vaccines.

01:04:33.110 --> 01:04:34.331
I didn't have COVID.

01:04:34.351 --> 01:04:35.731
The vaccine gave you COVID?

01:04:36.411 --> 01:04:41.832
Sorry, Bill Maher, like, didn't have COVID because he, like, works on his own compound.

01:04:41.852 --> 01:04:42.512
Yes.

01:04:42.612 --> 01:04:51.094
It's never near like... Bill Maher didn't get COVID because he works on his own compound, that he doesn't mingle with anybody, that he hates children.

01:04:54.733 --> 01:04:55.934
Again, this is a script.

01:04:56.095 --> 01:04:57.556
This is scripted bullshit.

01:04:57.716 --> 01:04:59.538
It's sad, but it's real.

01:05:01.601 --> 01:05:03.202
These people get millions of views.

01:05:04.784 --> 01:05:09.770
And they get millions of views criticizing Brett Weinstein and making fun of Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

01:05:09.870 --> 01:05:11.632
It's very, very, very, very bad.

01:05:14.016 --> 01:05:39.204
OK, yesterday on CBS's Face the Nation, Donald Trump's former pick for FDA or his pick for FDA commissioner, his FDA commissioner, Marty McCary, Dr. Marty McCary, spent time cherry picking vaccine skepticism with out of context statistics and attempting to pass them off as medical evidence.

01:05:39.824 --> 01:06:01.691
Margaret Brennan looks genuinely stunned and for good reason, because although this is an individual with a medical degree speaking, this was really a political influencer in a metaphorical lab coat pushing the idea that if enough people believe something about a vaccine, then it must be valid public health advice.

01:06:02.231 --> 01:06:06.332
If a lot of people don't like the vaccine, the vaccine must be bad.

01:06:06.772 --> 01:06:08.673
This is a doctor speaking.

01:06:09.133 --> 01:06:10.434
Take a listen to this.

01:06:10.454 --> 01:06:18.278
I don't know if you know these statistics, but for 88% of American kids, their parents have said no to the COVID shot last season.

01:06:18.318 --> 01:06:21.119
So the vast majority of Americans are saying no.

01:06:21.159 --> 01:06:23.140
Maybe they want to see some clinical data as well.

01:06:23.520 --> 01:06:24.941
Maybe they have concerns about the safety.

01:06:24.981 --> 01:06:26.542
I don't want to crowdsource my health guidance.

01:06:26.702 --> 01:06:28.022
I want a clear thing.

01:06:28.142 --> 01:06:29.703
You don't go with popularity.

01:06:29.783 --> 01:06:31.624
You go with, as you're saying, data.

01:06:31.744 --> 01:06:33.165
Yeah, so let's see the data.

01:06:33.385 --> 01:06:39.434
OK, so the CDC data said 41% of children age 6 months to 17 years hospitalized with COVID.

01:06:39.704 --> 01:06:44.586
between 2022 and 2024 did not have a known underlying condition.

01:06:44.626 --> 01:06:46.827
In other words, they looked healthy.

01:06:47.187 --> 01:06:49.108
And COVID was serious for them.

01:06:49.389 --> 01:06:59.253
So first of all, we know the CDC data is contaminated with a lot of false positives from incidental positive COVID tests with routine testing of every kid that walks.

01:06:59.273 --> 01:07:04.416
Incidental positive COVID means that COVID exists and that PCR works really well.

01:07:04.436 --> 01:07:06.376
It's just sometimes there are no symptoms.

01:07:06.997 --> 01:07:07.297
Stop!

01:07:08.539 --> 01:07:12.489
I know we covered this video before, but I just want you to see how David Pakman covers it.

01:07:12.509 --> 01:07:16.880
He's not gonna say that this is wrong because he's making vaccines a choice.

01:07:18.331 --> 01:07:20.273
and it's about medical choice.

01:07:20.393 --> 01:07:26.277
That's the message that we hear as part of the fake health freedom movement.

01:07:26.397 --> 01:07:28.359
And we think, oh yeah, he's saying it right.

01:07:28.419 --> 01:07:30.080
We don't want the vaccine anymore.

01:07:30.841 --> 01:07:33.963
And Mary Talley Bowden says, yeah, we don't want it anymore.

01:07:34.644 --> 01:07:36.825
So we should just not make it mandatory.

01:07:36.885 --> 01:07:39.787
That's how we decide, you know, but it's killing people.

01:07:39.847 --> 01:07:42.930
So it's gotta be better than this.

01:07:43.090 --> 01:07:46.773
It's gotta be better than this, except it's not because we're being sabotaged.

01:07:47.762 --> 01:07:48.643
walks in the hospital.

01:07:49.003 --> 01:07:59.789
When I go to the ICU, when I walk to the P, we know that data historically under the Biden administration did not distinguish being sick from COVID or an incidental positive COVID test.

01:07:59.809 --> 01:08:06.013
When you go to an ICU in America and you ask how many people are in the ICU that are healthy, that are sick with COVID,

01:08:06.793 --> 01:08:10.496
The answer I get again and again is we haven't seen that in a year or years.

01:08:10.976 --> 01:08:16.281
And so the worst thing you can do in public health is to put out an absolute universal recommendation in young healthy kids.

01:08:16.661 --> 01:08:19.603
And the vast majority of Americans are saying, no, we want to see some data.

01:08:19.643 --> 01:08:21.204
And you say, forget about the data.

01:08:21.244 --> 01:08:22.025
Just get it anyway.

01:08:22.125 --> 01:08:32.188
Okay, so on data and transparency, for decades, since 1964, it was the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices, ACIP, that went through this panel recommendation.

01:08:32.248 --> 01:08:34.988
I mean, people watched these things during COVID.

01:08:35.068 --> 01:08:37.029
The report was then handed up.

01:08:37.409 --> 01:08:42.850
It offered debate, it offered transparency, and it offered data points that people could refer back to.

01:08:43.051 --> 01:08:48.432
Why did you bypass all of this and just come down with a decision before the panel could meet?

01:08:48.632 --> 01:08:52.535
And that data, that panel has been a kangaroo court where they just rubbish.

01:08:52.935 --> 01:08:55.978
So listen, the data is bad because of this reason.

01:08:56.518 --> 01:08:59.100
The CDC panel is bad because of this reason.

01:08:59.600 --> 01:09:01.722
Just trust Bobby Kennedy, Jr.

01:09:02.182 --> 01:09:07.687
and whatever he tells you, as you and now you have these health freedom people screaming in the background.

01:09:07.727 --> 01:09:09.128
Yeah, but Simpson would.

01:09:09.188 --> 01:09:10.669
That data is important.

01:09:10.709 --> 01:09:16.173
And William Thompson's a whistleblower and it's black kids that got autism and they hid the signal.

01:09:17.314 --> 01:09:18.375
It's all being set up.

01:09:20.222 --> 01:09:32.669
And it's all going to happen on its own little corner of the internet where the vast majority of people will still just be making fun, will still just be lambasting the health freedom movement as fake and ridiculous.

01:09:33.850 --> 01:09:36.271
And with ease, they're going to be able to do it.

01:09:36.351 --> 01:09:36.992
With ease.

01:09:38.516 --> 01:09:49.908
wipes raw milk off of his mouth and trust Marty McCary and trust the fact that a great number of Americans are self-destructive and stubbornly ignorant.

01:09:50.488 --> 01:09:53.251
And as a result of that, they haven't gotten the vaccine.

01:09:53.271 --> 01:09:55.273
So I noticed that he also has a book.

01:09:56.395 --> 01:09:58.597
All of these people apparently get to have a book.

01:10:00.799 --> 01:10:01.580
You shouldn't either.

01:10:02.100 --> 01:10:13.610
And Margaret Brennan does a really good job of exposing Marty McCary here for making it up as he goes along, making conflicting recommendations, casting doubt on CDC data, while then saying, no, the data you can believe.

01:10:14.110 --> 01:10:21.357
And he is so terrible during this interview that she is left shaking her head as she wraps it up.

01:10:22.469 --> 01:10:27.894
And of course we looked at that too, so we don't need to appeal to that part of it.

01:10:28.514 --> 01:10:35.580
From Microbe TV, this is Beyond the Noise, episode number 68, recorded on the 4th of June, 2025.

01:10:36.101 --> 01:10:37.902
This is pretty hardcore.

01:10:43.359 --> 01:10:47.342
I'm Vincent Racaniello, and joining me today is your host, Dr. Paul Offit.

01:10:47.683 --> 01:10:48.183
Hi, Vincent.

01:10:48.823 --> 01:10:49.604
Hello, Paul.

01:10:50.085 --> 01:10:58.892
This is the video version of Paul's column on Substack called Beyond the Noise, cutting to the chase on important health topics.

01:10:58.932 --> 01:11:03.295
Today, we're going to have a look at Paul's column entitled, RFK Jr.'

01:11:03.275 --> 01:11:06.238
's War on Children.

01:11:07.372 --> 01:11:11.318
So let's talk about this war, Paul.

01:11:11.338 --> 01:11:15.104
At the end of May, he made an announcement about COVID vaccines.

01:11:15.124 --> 01:11:16.005
What was that all about?

01:11:17.147 --> 01:11:23.176
Right, so he, on a three-minute video, posted on X. He could be in his pajamas right now.

01:11:24.650 --> 01:11:31.574
He's with Marty McCary, the FDA commissioner at his right, and Jay Bhattacharya, the head of the National Institutes of Health on his left.

01:11:31.654 --> 01:11:39.258
He said that we are no longer going to recommend COVID vaccines for healthy children or for healthy pregnant women.

01:11:39.559 --> 01:11:51.886
I couldn't be more pleased to announce that as of today, the COVID vaccine for healthy children and healthy pregnant women has been removed from the CDC recommended immunization schedule.

01:11:52.930 --> 01:11:56.058
What I was hoping we could focus on today was the children's part.

01:11:57.139 --> 01:11:59.280
So why is that wrong?

01:12:00.000 --> 01:12:14.565
The CDC, in the person of Fiona Havers, in April of this year, presented data updating the Advisory Committee for Immunization Practices on where we stand with the current COVID epidemic.

01:12:15.726 --> 01:12:20.527
And what she said was that during the past year, there were 165,000 hospitalizations for COVID and 40,000 deaths.

01:12:25.345 --> 01:12:29.847
Now, most of those hospitalizations and deaths were in people who were older, who had chronic conditions.

01:12:29.927 --> 01:12:53.337
Now, one of the things I'd like to point out here, while I am still in the middle of this one, is that again, one of the arguments that I would like you to regularly remind yourself of is that at the beginning of the pandemic, everybody on the health freedom movement side, the narrative control side, the Kevin McKernan, Charles Rixey, Mary Holland,

01:12:54.738 --> 01:13:09.067
Andrew Kaufman, all of these people were on a script about a virus and whether or not that virus was real or whether or not the sequence could really be found or whether it can be grown or purified or cultured.

01:13:10.448 --> 01:13:12.570
But the debate was about that virus.

01:13:13.823 --> 01:13:19.985
And it's important to see that because that debate has never really gone anywhere.

01:13:20.185 --> 01:13:39.471
Even though our side says that there are very specific biological pieces from Kevin McKernan, to Kevin McCairn, to Charles Rixey, all the way up to Jeffrey Sachs that believe that there are specific molecular parts of the spike protein

01:13:40.290 --> 01:13:45.314
which made it the most infectious virus, the most dangerous virus that we've ever seen.

01:13:45.834 --> 01:13:57.282
Some of these people even say that there are pre-onogenic sequences there that are potentially dangerous from a Jakob Krausfeld, Jakob's disease.

01:13:59.764 --> 01:14:09.871
And yet nowhere on either side of the narrative is anyone paying attention to these biological phenomenon to tell us that it's all clear.

01:14:11.104 --> 01:14:27.439
to tell us that they're gone, to tell us that the biological signals which we attributed to a laboratory signal, a lab unlimited bioweapon, a flying AIDS virus,

01:14:28.510 --> 01:14:38.774
a flying AIDS vaccine, all of these things suggest that there is sufficient technical knowledge that the danger could have been monitored from a molecular perspective.

01:14:38.814 --> 01:14:48.818
And yet the only people that have the requisite knowledge to monitor this from a molecular perspective, you know, like Jessica Rose and apparently Kevin McKernan,

01:14:49.690 --> 01:14:52.151
They aren't monitoring these sequences at all.

01:14:52.191 --> 01:15:13.602
We just watched a video from the other day on Friday with Steven Hatfill also talking about the staphylococcus enterotoxin B overlap, some kind of, you know, sequence that's just crazy immunogenic, but he's not really monitoring it.

01:15:13.622 --> 01:15:15.704
He's not sure if it's in any of the vaccines or not.

01:15:15.724 --> 01:15:16.484
He's never checked.

01:15:17.796 --> 01:15:24.770
This is the kind of the level of bullshit that you have to accept in order to think that you're still running in a wheel that's going anywhere.

01:15:26.553 --> 01:15:29.338
That Stephen Hatfield is just not a traitor.

01:15:31.223 --> 01:15:52.543
that Robert Malone's just not a traitor, that this guy hasn't been just doing the same shtick, the same national security shtick for the last 20 years because he's been doing it in cooperation with Mary Holland, in cooperation with Aaron Seery, in cooperation with Merrill Nass, in cooperation with all of them.

01:15:54.304 --> 01:15:57.167
That's why none of them have made any progress in winning.

01:16:00.202 --> 01:16:01.264
The goal isn't to win.

01:16:05.854 --> 01:16:09.422
But there were roughly 6,600 hospitalizations.

01:16:12.200 --> 01:16:13.701
150 deaths in children.

01:16:14.521 --> 01:16:22.303
A lot of that was in children less than four, who are profoundly under-vaccinated group, only 5% of children in that age group are vaccinated.

01:16:22.963 --> 01:16:33.527
What was also interesting was that it depended on whether you looked at the zero to two-year-old or two to four-year-old, but between 40 to 60% of those who were hospitalized and died were previously healthy.

01:16:34.267 --> 01:16:37.670
One in five who were hospitalized were sent to the intensive care unit.

01:16:37.750 --> 01:16:45.616
So what that tells you is that can young children, children less than four years of age, be hospitalized and die even though they are previously healthy?

01:16:45.916 --> 01:16:46.696
The answer is yes.

01:16:47.237 --> 01:16:54.542
So what we had is we had a recommendation for all children to get a primary series of vaccines.

01:16:55.203 --> 01:16:57.905
And unfortunately, that appears to have disappeared.

01:16:59.026 --> 01:17:02.108
So it's not just boosters we're talking about.

01:17:02.128 --> 01:17:03.429
It's the primary series.

01:17:06.519 --> 01:17:07.820
So let me understand this.

01:17:08.360 --> 01:17:09.120
RFK Jr.

01:17:09.220 --> 01:17:11.401
is a lawyer and a politician.

01:17:11.441 --> 01:17:15.663
Makary is a surgeon, but the Charya is a health economist.

01:17:15.703 --> 01:17:19.745
None of them have any expertise in public health or virology.

01:17:20.565 --> 01:17:28.989
They just decided to overrule, basically a licensed vaccine has been approved for use in these age groups, correct?

01:17:30.177 --> 01:17:51.648
right so the way this i think this is all about project 2025 in the end it's all about project 2025 stop lying and again this is just you know prerequisite reading just to make sure that they they reinforce the hamster wheel you can go read that crazy document and oh my gosh they really are nuts

01:17:52.981 --> 01:17:54.682
We were set up, ladies and gentlemen.

01:17:54.702 --> 01:18:04.848
The American conservative right was set up by people like Brian Hooker, and people like Mary Holland, and people like Steve Bannon, and people like Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

01:18:04.888 --> 01:18:08.310
Witting or unwitting, he's as responsible as the rest of them.

01:18:09.891 --> 01:18:11.552
This is really awful where we are.

01:18:13.055 --> 01:18:13.956
It's really awful.

01:18:13.996 --> 01:18:24.765
The reason why Paul Offit hasn't retired and handed the torch to somebody else is because he is a deep state national security actor, just like Mary Holland is.

01:18:25.495 --> 01:18:32.677
If you look at Project 2025 under the CDC, what they want to do is eliminate the CDC as a recommending body.

01:18:33.237 --> 01:18:43.920
So the way this is settled out for children is that now any child between six months and 17 years of age should have a shared clinical decision making with the physician.

01:18:44.700 --> 01:18:46.761
So what that does is it takes away the recommendation.

01:18:47.401 --> 01:18:53.344
And the minute that you take away is recommended or should be given, then it can no longer be mandated.

01:18:53.404 --> 01:18:55.145
Now, COVID vaccines aren't mandated.

01:18:55.265 --> 01:19:04.069
So I don't know why they're targeting COVID, and maybe this is just round one of what is going to be an attempt to get the CDC to back off of any recommendations.

01:19:04.429 --> 01:19:07.470
But what upsets me about this is the way that they portray it.

01:19:07.730 --> 01:19:12.733
They say, what we want to do is we want to strengthen the relationship between the patient and the doctor.

01:19:13.533 --> 01:19:21.456
But doctors and other healthcare professionals look to the ACIP and they look to the CDC for recommendations because those are the people who have the data.

01:19:21.996 --> 01:19:31.739
I was at a meeting yesterday of about 200 healthcare professionals and I said, how many of you know, you know, how many children were hospitalized and how many children died last year?

01:19:32.339 --> 01:19:35.620
of COVID and whether or not they were vaccinated and whether or not they were healthy.

01:19:35.961 --> 01:19:36.801
And very few did.

01:19:37.181 --> 01:19:39.882
And that's why we looked at the CDC for those recommendations.

01:19:39.922 --> 01:19:45.405
If you're asking all doctors in this country to understand all the primary data, that's asking for too much.

01:19:46.985 --> 01:19:57.330
Well, Paul, welcome to Public Health by edict, not by... Understanding the data implies that it's somehow really complicated to understand how vaccines work, but it shouldn't be.

01:19:58.070 --> 01:19:58.970
It really shouldn't be.

01:19:59.831 --> 01:20:00.371
But it is.

01:20:02.290 --> 01:20:07.854
It's very, very complicated to understand how intramuscular injection works in all these different contexts.

01:20:07.914 --> 01:20:08.775
It's just difficult.

01:20:08.835 --> 01:20:14.959
It's, you know, and you can't expect all doctors to understand all these nuances, but the data is out there.

01:20:15.479 --> 01:20:18.641
Committee, that's the whole point of the administration.

01:20:18.681 --> 01:20:30.310
You know, the latest executive order restoring gold standard science is basically taking the decisions away from committees and putting them in the hands of individual politicians even.

01:20:31.090 --> 01:20:32.632
it's, and this is the same thing.

01:20:33.292 --> 01:20:42.761
The way this should work is if you really are moving away from a routine primary series recommendation for children, because let's just focus on that for a minute.

01:20:43.762 --> 01:20:52.631
What you would normally do is you would bring that question up for the advisory committee for immunization practice, a group of experts in virology, immunology, public health, vaccinology, et cetera.

01:20:53.231 --> 01:20:58.233
They would uniformly recommend a primary vaccine series for the reasons we just talked about.

01:20:58.393 --> 01:21:01.455
This is a virus that can still cause children to be hospitalized and die.

01:21:01.475 --> 01:21:07.457
In fact, more children were hospitalized and died this past year from COVID than from flu, for which there is a routine recommendation.

01:21:07.837 --> 01:21:09.898
So they would definitely have recommended it.

01:21:10.078 --> 01:21:18.602
The only way that these numbers are possible is because PCR is the gold standard diagnostic now, and the FDA is not going to do anything about it.

01:21:19.878 --> 01:21:24.205
Our FDA is being sabotaged with farmers markets.

01:21:28.973 --> 01:21:31.455
So to get around that, what you do is just what you said.

01:21:31.935 --> 01:21:32.816
You make it an eating.

01:21:32.936 --> 01:21:40.922
You stay, you have a three minute video post on X, where you say, this is what we're going to do, as if it's been handed down on stone tablets from on high.

01:21:41.283 --> 01:21:43.124
You don't have input from the ACIP.

01:21:43.144 --> 01:21:47.347
You don't have input from professional societies, you know, like the American Academy.

01:21:47.367 --> 01:21:52.471
But make no mistake about it, all of those things are just, they're just show trial stuff, right?

01:21:52.491 --> 01:21:53.993
They're not any more,

01:21:54.853 --> 01:21:57.796
legal than any of the other stuff that these things are done.

01:21:57.836 --> 01:22:11.848
Like the FDA is a legislated organization, you know, but the ACIP is just a, it's just a committee that meets that was established by the, it's not the same level of, of, you know, consequent.

01:22:12.209 --> 01:22:13.290
It's, it's ridiculous.

01:22:13.310 --> 01:22:16.072
Pediatrics, you don't have public comment.

01:22:16.232 --> 01:22:17.233
You don't allow none of it.

01:22:17.454 --> 01:22:19.956
You just state, this is what we're going to do.

01:22:21.184 --> 01:22:27.188
So is there any scientific basis for him withdrawing vaccines from these individuals?

01:22:28.028 --> 01:22:28.268
No.

01:22:29.329 --> 01:22:30.069
It's the opposite.

01:22:30.309 --> 01:22:39.415
You have a scientific basis to have a primary care, a primary recommendation, primary series recommendation for all children in this country because all children are at risk.

01:22:39.475 --> 01:22:40.075
It's interesting.

01:22:40.715 --> 01:22:45.738
The immunization rate in children less than five is about five percent.

01:22:45.918 --> 01:22:48.600
So it's most children are not vaccinated.

01:22:48.900 --> 01:22:52.961
All children by the age of six months will be fully susceptible to this virus.

01:22:53.201 --> 01:22:58.602
Once they passively transfer an antibiotic from the mother, following natural infection or immunization, the mother will have worn off.

01:22:59.182 --> 01:23:01.823
So they're completely susceptible by six months of age.

01:23:01.903 --> 01:23:03.143
The virus is still circulating.

01:23:03.283 --> 01:23:11.605
See, one of the problems here is, again, that there's this hyper focus on the specific memory of the immune system.

01:23:12.680 --> 01:23:19.825
And this disregards a couple really key parts of the immune system which can't be ignored.

01:23:19.886 --> 01:23:35.998
The first one is the complement system and the other one is these IgM antibodies which are far less specific but more generalized across motifs and can pick up a lot of things because that's the way biology works.

01:23:36.718 --> 01:23:43.844
And so again, he's really focused, hyper-focused on the NIH and NIAID model of immunity.

01:23:44.505 --> 01:23:56.074
Also, the same way that the whole regulation of vaccines is focused on immune landmarks and, what do you call it, surrogates.

01:23:57.133 --> 01:24:04.098
And this is very, very, very disingenuous, especially because we haven't made any progress on those immune surrogates in decades.

01:24:04.678 --> 01:24:05.819
That doesn't make any sense.

01:24:07.540 --> 01:24:19.388
And this is, again, a national security actor who is in place and working because it is considered a national security priority to keep people on narrative.

01:24:20.322 --> 01:24:31.968
And that narrative is, you know, never coming to the realization that intramuscular injection as a methodology is dumb, but there must be some untested part of it that maybe we made a mistake with, or sometimes it is.

01:24:32.088 --> 01:24:44.794
It's just inevitable that some people will get hurt, but they work so well, and they save so many more lives than they hurt, then objecting to their use or fighting against their mandate is just absurd.

01:24:44.834 --> 01:24:47.496
And that narrative is never gonna go away until we,

01:24:48.596 --> 01:24:56.889
snap out of it until we get off of social media and start really teaching people the true biology that these people are never going to talk about.

01:24:57.873 --> 01:25:01.336
I mean, SARS-CoV-2 virus is a short incubation period mucosal infection.

01:25:01.676 --> 01:25:05.059
Even if everybody in the country were vaccinated every year, the virus would still circulate.

01:25:05.439 --> 01:25:08.501
So you have a circulating virus and an at-risk population.

01:25:08.541 --> 01:25:20.470
If you look at the number of hospitalizations and deaths from children now, young children, children less than five, it's not that much different than at the beginning of the pandemic when there was a vaccine available because it's a highly susceptible population who's not being vaccinated.

01:25:20.550 --> 01:25:26.355
It's not that much different except that I understand that a lot of the scientific community thinks that it is.

01:25:27.332 --> 01:25:41.358
thinks that it's different from the perspective of whether or not it has HIV inserts or pre-onogenic sequences and the staphylococcus and teratoxin B homology.

01:25:42.439 --> 01:25:48.502
These signals that everybody on our side seems to be aware of for like five years now, but nobody has kept track of.

01:25:50.082 --> 01:25:51.163
Nobody cares about.

01:25:52.301 --> 01:25:56.763
Yet they're supposedly the biological basis for the emergency in the first place.

01:25:56.823 --> 01:26:00.125
Otherwise it would just be another virus in the anus of a bat.

01:26:01.006 --> 01:26:02.767
And we wouldn't be worried about it.

01:26:02.807 --> 01:26:08.830
It was the fact that we sprayed all these things into a bat cave with fear and cleavage sites.

01:26:08.910 --> 01:26:10.511
Like that was the whole point, right?

01:26:12.443 --> 01:26:18.448
And yet, somehow or another, this guy seems woefully unaware that that's what the other side believes.

01:26:18.488 --> 01:26:20.589
That that's what the narrative is based on.

01:26:20.609 --> 01:26:24.572
That that's why people are talking about natural immunity and all this other stuff.

01:26:24.592 --> 01:26:26.874
That's why people are talking about the spike protein.

01:26:27.715 --> 01:26:30.397
They're not even, that's not even on their radar.

01:26:35.239 --> 01:26:43.479
And so you need to see how far apart we are from our fellow Americans, how far apart you are from your fellow countrymen around the world.

01:26:44.557 --> 01:26:48.741
if you don't realize that the spike protein is not on this guy's radar.

01:26:48.801 --> 01:27:02.033
The furin cleavage site, the HIV inserts, the staphylococcus enterotoxin B overlap, the preontogenic sequences, the amyloid, it's not on their radar at all.

01:27:02.093 --> 01:27:03.795
It's not in the narrative at all.

01:27:04.355 --> 01:27:07.158
If anything, it is that COVID causes those things.

01:27:12.307 --> 01:27:38.467
And because we have allowed our flag to be carried into the White House by Jay Bhattacharya, and Marty McCarty, and Dr. Oz, and frickin' Robert F. Kennedy Jr., backed for years by Mary Holland, and Meryl Nass, and Brian Hooker, everybody just seems to die around him.

01:27:38.587 --> 01:27:41.870
His wife, Brandy Vaughn, Tony Bark,

01:27:47.833 --> 01:27:58.596
And so just to be clear, the immunization of pregnant women, I know you don't want to talk about that, which has been eliminated, that would protect these infants under six months of age, right?

01:27:58.896 --> 01:27:59.896
That's exactly right.

01:27:59.936 --> 01:28:01.437
Yes, yes, definitely.

01:28:01.597 --> 01:28:09.839
I mean, if you vaccinate a pregnant woman, if you transfect a pregnant woman, you are protecting the baby.

01:28:09.899 --> 01:28:13.380
That is how dark this is right now.

01:28:15.114 --> 01:28:17.896
And that's why you can see he's not a biologist.

01:28:17.956 --> 01:28:20.717
He's not a doctor playing the role of a doctor.

01:28:21.978 --> 01:28:25.180
He is a liar reading a provided script.

01:28:25.360 --> 01:28:31.983
And the chances are really good, the script that he's on is provided by Kevin McKernan and Robert Malone.

01:28:32.864 --> 01:28:36.526
That's how malevolent this picture is right now.

01:28:39.625 --> 01:28:45.951
And that was also a significant percentage of those less than four-year-olds that were getting hospitalized were children less than six months of age.

01:28:45.991 --> 01:28:49.013
They're not going to benefit from any sort of active immunization schedule.

01:28:49.053 --> 01:28:52.797
They need passive immunization either from a mother.

01:28:53.517 --> 01:29:04.927
One of the reasons why they might want to expose the infants to these shots early is so that they develop a tolerance to the PEG and tolerance to the cationic lipids.

01:29:04.967 --> 01:29:06.108
That's a possibility.

01:29:06.849 --> 01:29:22.096
Because one of the downsides of exposing people to phospholipids like PEG and these other cationic lipids is that they can develop an immune response to them, and that could lead to the clotting as well.

01:29:23.117 --> 01:29:29.420
And so that's already well understood, because of course, before the pandemic, people had developed autoimmunity to PEG from vaping.

01:29:31.704 --> 01:29:40.588
And so one of the motivations for wanting to get at fetuses might be to see if a tolerance could be induced, something like that.

01:29:40.628 --> 01:29:48.932
I'm just speculating here because obviously there's no good reason to intramuscularly inject a pregnant woman that can't eat sushi because it's dangerous.

01:29:49.092 --> 01:29:55.075
Well, from a mother who was vaccinated, yet another reason to vaccinate a pregnant person, right?

01:29:55.095 --> 01:29:55.855
Yeah, and beyond that,

01:29:57.972 --> 01:30:01.694
pregnant women are particularly susceptible to severe COVID because they're immunosuppressed, right?

01:30:01.714 --> 01:30:02.294
That's right.

01:30:02.474 --> 01:30:04.515
We're going to talk about that next time.

01:30:04.876 --> 01:30:04.996
Okay.

01:30:05.636 --> 01:30:09.518
So some people argue that 150 child deaths is very small.

01:30:09.558 --> 01:30:10.398
We shouldn't worry about it.

01:30:10.418 --> 01:30:11.159
What do you say to that?

01:30:12.526 --> 01:30:16.887
So maybe it would be easier for people to handle this if we didn't do it as a statistic.

01:30:17.387 --> 01:30:20.087
Maybe it would be better if what we did is we listed all those.

01:30:20.187 --> 01:30:28.329
So the next thing I want to show you is this, uh, this thing here, um, with Jay Bhattacharya, but I gotta, I gotta put it up on the screen.

01:30:28.729 --> 01:30:37.931
Um, and so I think what I have set up here is a very quick musical break, and then, um, we're going to go on with that.

01:30:37.991 --> 01:30:38.591
Is that correct?

01:30:39.147 --> 01:30:40.007
Is that not right?

01:30:41.048 --> 01:30:41.728
Is that not right?

01:30:41.928 --> 01:30:42.668
It doesn't look right.

01:30:43.068 --> 01:30:43.609
Oh, shoot.

01:30:45.329 --> 01:30:47.870
Okay, so I don't even have a musical break in here, do I?

01:30:48.330 --> 01:30:49.031
I guess I don't.

01:30:49.631 --> 01:30:52.892
Where... Well, anyway, I guess we're just gonna show it.

01:30:55.993 --> 01:30:59.635
I would like to take a musical break right now, then, if you don't mind, and then I'll come back to that.

01:31:01.403 --> 01:31:05.629
Because I need to move my legs for a second and get a drink.

01:31:05.809 --> 01:31:07.632
And so I'll be right back in like five minutes.

01:31:08.593 --> 01:31:12.298
And we will watch this Jay Bhattacharya thing.

01:31:12.338 --> 01:31:13.520
I think you'll really like it a lot.

01:33:02.105 --> 01:33:02.486
No way.

01:33:02.726 --> 01:33:06.953
And if it's a price I pay, some say.

01:34:09.380 --> 01:34:11.669
No way, no way

01:35:47.665 --> 01:35:51.127
What an interesting post, you know, chat message.

01:35:51.247 --> 01:35:57.730
I actually considered the Equalizer theme as one of the possible themes I would use.

01:35:58.931 --> 01:36:04.333
Settling on the NBA theme was kind of easy, but I looked at Airwolf too.

01:36:04.413 --> 01:36:06.374
Actually, Airwolf was a really good theme as well.

01:36:06.855 --> 01:36:08.656
And Magnum PI I've used before.

01:36:08.696 --> 01:36:10.557
You know that I've used Magnum PI before.

01:36:10.617 --> 01:36:13.578
Anyway, I didn't know that he did that though.

01:36:13.618 --> 01:36:17.420
I just chose the Equalizer because I used to really like that show when I was a kid.

01:36:17.935 --> 01:36:21.099
Now, Dr. Gallo and Dr. Fauci talked a lot about isolation and purification.

01:36:21.579 --> 01:36:23.381
Can you tell me what the difference is between the two?

01:36:25.384 --> 01:36:26.145
Isolation, what was it?

01:36:26.926 --> 01:36:27.546
Isolation and purification.

01:36:29.248 --> 01:36:29.969
Of the virus?

01:36:30.069 --> 01:36:30.270
Yes.

01:36:31.511 --> 01:36:33.273
Well, you isolate a virus by

01:36:40.077 --> 01:36:42.559
finding the virus which causes a disease.

01:36:43.200 --> 01:36:48.084
You purify a virus by making a lot of, I mean, just by purifying it so you get a pure virus.

01:36:48.865 --> 01:36:50.886
I don't understand what the issue.

01:36:51.007 --> 01:36:56.471
Well, they interchanged the two and I wasn't sure if it was the same thing or if it was two totally different.

01:36:57.552 --> 01:36:58.693
No, it depends on how they used it.

01:36:59.154 --> 01:37:00.435
Okay.

01:37:00.575 --> 01:37:02.336
Can you explain the process of HIV isolation?

01:37:05.543 --> 01:37:07.486
Well, didn't Dr. Gallo do that?

01:37:07.546 --> 01:37:09.850
I mean, he actually isolated it, so.

01:37:09.870 --> 01:37:13.596
I mean, why should I do all of this?

01:37:13.676 --> 01:37:15.679
This is all textbook stuff you're asking me.

01:37:21.539 --> 01:37:26.962
And let me just click over here and click over here and that should work.

01:37:27.022 --> 01:37:27.882
Good morning everybody.

01:37:27.922 --> 01:37:28.563
Welcome to the show.

01:37:28.603 --> 01:37:32.885
This is GigaOM Biological, a high resistance, low noise information brief brought to you by a biologist.

01:37:33.506 --> 01:37:38.489
Coming into the second half here, we are still working on this puzzle.

01:37:39.649 --> 01:37:43.251
This is still a stream that is supported only by viewers like you.

01:37:43.291 --> 01:37:47.214
If you want to share the stream, please share stream.gigaom.bio because

01:37:47.794 --> 01:37:53.978
There you can download a lower resolution version that you could post somewhere that you could cut up.

01:37:54.338 --> 01:37:57.900
You can also download an audio version that you could start your own podcast with.

01:37:58.040 --> 01:38:00.522
I want you to spread this however you need to spread it.

01:38:00.662 --> 01:38:01.783
Just send it to people.

01:38:02.443 --> 01:38:03.464
Let them know it's there.

01:38:04.184 --> 01:38:08.787
Please use stream.gigom.bio because I don't want people to be sent to YouTube.

01:38:08.807 --> 01:38:10.548
I don't want people finding me on Rumble.

01:38:11.489 --> 01:38:14.712
I want people to go where they can download and where they won't be served ads.

01:38:15.432 --> 01:38:19.796
And just remind them when you share it, in case you're not aware, there's no logins.

01:38:19.856 --> 01:38:22.678
There's no, you don't need any accounts.

01:38:22.778 --> 01:38:30.245
And there's probably a couple places in there where you could fill out a form and it looks like you're logging in, but those don't need, they're not needed, they don't work.

01:38:30.905 --> 01:38:34.467
They're part of the template that I haven't managed to get rid of yet.

01:38:34.687 --> 01:38:36.128
And so the same with my website.

01:38:37.108 --> 01:38:42.571
If you want to get in touch with me and my family, it's gigaohmhq at proton.me.

01:38:42.811 --> 01:38:50.895
Everything else is kind of a mishmash of things where like the website, we can get your email, but there's no log in there because we don't have any files there.

01:38:51.855 --> 01:38:52.915
Trying to do that.

01:38:53.075 --> 01:39:13.542
So even though there's that functionality is built into a lot of these prototypes or a lot of these templates We're not using it We just want you to share the stream and if you're if you're willing to support then that's getting on biological.com And there's a couple different ways to do that and I appreciate it a lot What do I got here?

01:39:14.162 --> 01:39:15.002
Is this something?

01:39:15.703 --> 01:39:16.743
Did I have something here?

01:39:16.803 --> 01:39:18.584
I'm not sure if I have something there or not.

01:39:18.604 --> 01:39:19.384
I don't think I do

01:39:20.465 --> 01:39:49.733
um what is that thing let me see animations that is the next generation of what um let me see what this is uh i don't know if this is what i want or if i'm just gonna go out of powerpoint here let me just see what this is oh yeah okay okay gen z slang some cool gen z slang

01:39:51.141 --> 01:39:52.982
Listicle from Parade Magazine, that's gonna help.

01:39:53.882 --> 01:39:54.182
Oh, hey.

01:39:54.202 --> 01:39:57.024
So this guy's got about a million and a half followers.

01:39:57.104 --> 01:40:05.148
Him and his wife make a news program, and they are also ridiculing the health freedom movement, and very, very effectively.

01:40:05.568 --> 01:40:06.708
Make sure you understand that.

01:40:06.728 --> 01:40:14.012
Hey, fam, it's me, your bussin' Chad.

01:40:15.575 --> 01:40:17.616
Gooning at you in 4K.

01:40:17.736 --> 01:40:19.717
I do not think that's the correct use of gooning.

01:40:20.858 --> 01:40:24.400
Okay, so no cap, that's not gonna work.

01:40:24.540 --> 01:40:26.180
Listen, here's some news.

01:40:26.681 --> 01:40:30.803
It appears that the far right is knuckle deep in online media these days.

01:40:31.203 --> 01:40:36.966
According to this Media Matters graph, right-leaning shows have a far larger audience than left-leaning shows.

01:40:37.006 --> 01:40:38.847
I mean, we're not even on that graph.

01:40:38.887 --> 01:40:41.709
Come on, Dave Pakman, he doesn't even have a beard.

01:40:41.869 --> 01:40:44.410
His name sounds like the worst Atari spinoff game.

01:40:44.650 --> 01:40:47.692
I'm not mad, I've never been mad.

01:40:47.972 --> 01:40:53.575
So he mentions Dave Pakman, who we just agreed earlier, nobody sees him anyway.

01:40:54.976 --> 01:40:59.599
But again, this is how I want you to, I want you to be aware of how they amplify one another.

01:41:00.438 --> 01:41:02.640
how they are scripted to amplify one another.

01:41:02.700 --> 01:41:08.805
And even if they auditioned and now they've been selected, they all have elaborate sponsorships.

01:41:08.865 --> 01:41:10.246
They all have staff.

01:41:10.346 --> 01:41:12.368
They are all making a lot of money.

01:41:12.428 --> 01:41:16.892
They are making a full living reading the script that they are provided with.

01:41:17.092 --> 01:41:26.500
Even if that script is largely given to them by hints and secondhand stuff, and they're just good at staying where they're supposed to be.

01:41:28.459 --> 01:41:41.183
The reason why it is that the right wing is paying attention to more things on social media is because the people that are trying to figure things out are the ones that need that attention.

01:41:42.544 --> 01:41:56.088
The Rogans, the Weinsteins, the Jordan Petersons, the Teo Vons, all of these people are out there to herd cats

01:41:58.288 --> 01:41:59.709
The sheep don't need herding.

01:42:02.890 --> 01:42:04.310
They are herding the cats.

01:42:04.691 --> 01:42:14.334
And once the cats are herded, you can make fun of the cats to the sheep by saying, look at those cats.

01:42:14.674 --> 01:42:16.275
They don't even know they're being herded.

01:42:16.815 --> 01:42:22.017
Cats aren't even supposed to be able to be herded, but look at how easy and vulnerable they are to it.

01:42:24.458 --> 01:42:26.199
And the sheep go, wow, that's crazy.

01:42:29.141 --> 01:42:30.182
That's what you see here.

01:42:30.662 --> 01:42:38.447
So anyway, I was talking with Harris and Biden and all my other pet gerbils, and we were brainstorming ways to make a buck in this new online climate.

01:42:38.887 --> 01:42:48.033
I asked Rock, that's my other gerbil, and he pointed out that if you really want to make money these days, you apparently just have to say the N-word in public.

01:42:48.533 --> 01:42:51.354
He also started talking about white genocide for some reason.

01:42:51.654 --> 01:42:59.298
Anyway, a lady called a child a slur and is now crowdfunding over $700,000 and counting.

01:42:59.958 --> 01:43:02.779
Cool wor- I mean, imagine that that's real.

01:43:04.320 --> 01:43:06.981
Where is that $700,000 coming from?

01:43:07.061 --> 01:43:09.622
From people that are giving to the internet for the first time?

01:43:09.642 --> 01:43:17.686
You know, I've been sitting on the sidelines for five years, but now that this woman has used the N-word, I think I'm gonna finally start donating to somebody's Give, Send, Go.

01:43:21.334 --> 01:43:26.300
And this went away as quickly as it came because social media allows that to happen.

01:43:26.680 --> 01:43:35.731
And then it allows the actors on social media, not the algorithm, but the actors on social media that are paid to reinforce that theater.

01:43:37.281 --> 01:43:38.662
world we're living in.

01:43:38.922 --> 01:43:40.704
Kinda makes you wanna check out forever.

01:43:40.924 --> 01:43:42.205
Remember the movie Cool World?

01:43:42.626 --> 01:43:45.528
Anyway, anyway, anyway, anyway, fam.

01:43:46.148 --> 01:43:48.911
Anyway, fam, today we're gonna talk about all of this.

01:43:49.251 --> 01:43:56.137
The racist-ass internet, the right-wing dominance of online media, and the apparent appeal of Trumpism for Gen Z men.

01:43:56.457 --> 01:44:03.003
It's all deeply connected and interwoven into insidious forces from above, just like my gerbil maze.

01:44:04.924 --> 01:44:05.385
Riz.

01:44:09.409 --> 01:44:09.929
M.A.G.A.

01:44:10.309 --> 01:44:11.610
The Next Generation.

01:44:14.531 --> 01:44:17.051
Kids love 90s Star Trek references.

01:44:17.312 --> 01:44:18.612
Also, I don't actually have gerbils.

01:44:18.772 --> 01:44:20.393
I lied to make myself seem cooler.

01:44:20.533 --> 01:44:23.253
Remember that one of the guys that he could talk about with M.A.G.A.

01:44:23.273 --> 01:44:25.054
The Next Generation is Laura Loomer.

01:44:25.294 --> 01:44:31.116
Laura Loomer is a thumbnail colleague of Soph.

01:44:32.233 --> 01:44:34.015
the daughter of Sasha Latupova.

01:44:34.856 --> 01:44:41.101
And Laura Loomer is rooting for Palantir's full force to be released in L.A.

01:44:42.122 --> 01:44:51.011
on X, of course, not on mainstream media or not on some other media platform, just on X and Rumble, because that's how this works.

01:44:53.849 --> 01:44:55.311
and succeeded.

01:44:55.732 --> 01:45:04.505
So, obvs, obvsiously, traditional media has been dead for a while now, and social media is the rat palace nesting inside its chest cavity.

01:45:04.905 --> 01:45:08.551
The social meds is now how one in five Americans get their news.

01:45:08.971 --> 01:45:12.472
This means that influencers are basically the new journalists.

01:45:12.632 --> 01:45:14.273
See, and they knew this.

01:45:14.873 --> 01:45:16.854
You can complain about it, but they knew it.

01:45:17.074 --> 01:45:18.334
This is by design.

01:45:18.874 --> 01:45:25.416
That's why people were put in place before and during the beginning of the pandemic to set this stage up.

01:45:26.797 --> 01:45:32.719
Just like Pauly Tommy was on 90 billboards to sway 6 million votes in the UK,

01:45:34.042 --> 01:45:58.294
They put people on the internet in place years ago to make sure that we would be exactly where we are right now with a fake health freedom movement in the White House that brought together the fringe left and the fringe right into some pseudo populist movement that has at its front people like Steve Bannon, Donald Trump, and fricking Bobby Kennedy.

01:45:59.435 --> 01:46:01.676
That's how disastrous this is right now.

01:46:03.383 --> 01:46:05.524
without all the pesky standards.

01:46:05.964 --> 01:46:15.586
And since the entire influencer economy is based on parasocial relationships with specific online personalities, it makes people far more susceptible to misinformation.

01:46:15.986 --> 01:46:29.109
People tend to explicitly trust the names they closely follow, as well as any lie if it's repeated enough times, even if that- Repeated enough times by enough different people, sometimes by multiple people on the same podcast.

01:46:29.129 --> 01:46:31.530
He's not quite there yet, but almost.

01:46:32.705 --> 01:46:35.047
lie directly goes against common knowledge.

01:46:35.467 --> 01:46:40.330
In other words, influencers are uniquely effective vessels for propaganda.

01:46:40.750 --> 01:46:42.552
It's a good name for them, influencers.

01:46:42.612 --> 01:46:48.696
They have no actual influence on anything important, but they do herd cats.

01:46:49.977 --> 01:46:57.942
That isn't to say they're all propagandists, mind you, but rather they are to propaganda what Burning Man is to staph infections.

01:46:58.383 --> 01:47:04.547
If you're getting all your news on, say, TikTok, you are far more likely to be blasted with misinformation.

01:47:04.927 --> 01:47:07.449
And boy, as of 2024, 39% of young people are doing just that.

01:47:10.851 --> 01:47:19.021
On an unrelated note, Donald Trump, the 78-year-old Republican president of the United States, is popular with the youths.

01:47:19.201 --> 01:47:26.810
Or rather, in the last election, Trump improved with young men and young women, the latter still very much being majority blue voters.

01:47:27.290 --> 01:47:34.973
This obviously depends on which poll you're reading, but the reason the media is so focused on young men is because that margin is a lot tighter.

01:47:35.353 --> 01:47:38.474
They are somewhat up for grabs, but still leaning Trump.

01:47:38.894 --> 01:47:50.678
And what was particularly shocking, at least for the mainstream media, was that Trump seemingly won over the social media generation while also spending significantly less than Harris on TV and digital ads.

01:47:51.158 --> 01:47:55.781
But of course, if you spend any time online, you probably know what happened.

01:47:55.841 --> 01:47:57.362
Why didn't he have to spend money?

01:47:57.422 --> 01:48:01.165
It's because X. It's because of locals.

01:48:01.765 --> 01:48:02.966
It's because of rumble.

01:48:03.366 --> 01:48:05.147
That's why he didn't have to spend the money.

01:48:05.207 --> 01:48:05.788
Do you see it?

01:48:05.868 --> 01:48:08.289
Because of the fake health freedom movement.

01:48:08.329 --> 01:48:09.971
That's why he didn't have to spend the money.

01:48:13.913 --> 01:48:16.515
Just ask Dana White during Trump's victory party.

01:48:17.272 --> 01:48:18.793
I wanna thank some people real quick.

01:48:18.813 --> 01:48:29.120
I wanna thank the Nelk boys, Aiden Ross, Theo Vaughn, Bustin' with the Boys, and last but not least, the mighty and powerful Joe Rogan.

01:48:29.800 --> 01:48:33.143
Look at that big baby man thanking that other big baby man.

01:48:33.503 --> 01:48:38.206
To be clear, we're not gonna re-examine the last election or claim that this was solely why.

01:48:39.066 --> 01:48:40.547
So now we're gonna have a crash again.

01:48:40.607 --> 01:48:41.568
I apologize for that.

01:48:41.608 --> 01:48:43.089
Hopefully I'm not losing the stream here.

01:48:46.957 --> 01:48:47.518
But that's good.

01:48:47.778 --> 01:48:53.504
I'm going to show this video of Jay Bhattacharya because that's really where we were going with that.

01:48:55.226 --> 01:48:56.828
It's a really remarkable place, isn't it?

01:48:56.948 --> 01:48:59.190
It's crazy where we are.

01:48:59.270 --> 01:49:00.552
It's really crazy where we are.

01:49:00.612 --> 01:49:06.859
And the nice thing about watching this outside of the... Since 2012, there's been no increase in American life expectancy.

01:49:07.827 --> 01:49:18.529
From 2012 to 2019, literally, it was almost entirely flat life expectancy, whereas the European countries had advances in life expectancy during that period.

01:49:19.129 --> 01:49:21.190
During the pandemic, life expectancy dropped.

01:49:21.410 --> 01:49:22.250
Wow, interesting.

01:49:22.310 --> 01:49:26.391
So there's not been an increase in life expectancy for how long, Jay Bhattacharya?

01:49:26.451 --> 01:49:28.111
He's got all the numbers here, Mark.

01:49:28.251 --> 01:49:29.571
Looks like he's got all the numbers.

01:49:30.091 --> 01:49:33.512
Since 2012, there's been no increase in American life expectancy.

01:49:34.482 --> 01:49:43.836
from 2012 to 2019, literally it was almost entirely flat life expectancy, whereas the European countries had advances.

01:49:43.956 --> 01:49:46.480
I wonder if that could be because of the opioid crisis.

01:49:46.560 --> 01:49:48.844
I wonder if it's enough to eliminate 20,000 people.

01:49:50.646 --> 01:49:56.568
under the age of 40 every year to make sure that the life expectancy in America doesn't climb.

01:49:56.628 --> 01:50:06.552
I wonder if you could use, you know, not treating pneumonia with antibiotics enough to make sure that the life expectancy in America doesn't rise.

01:50:11.966 --> 01:50:12.326
I wonder.

01:50:12.346 --> 01:50:14.208
It's in life expectancy during that period.

01:50:14.789 --> 01:50:27.381
During the pandemic, life expectancy dropped very sharply in the United States and only just- And life expectancy cannot drop if the average age of death of COVID is above the life expectancy age.

01:50:28.399 --> 01:50:29.120
Understand that.

01:50:29.860 --> 01:50:45.573
If the only people that die are those people that are expected to die and have exceeded the expected age of death, like in Scotland, then the only way you get a reduced life expectancy is by killing younger people before they're supposed to die.

01:50:46.194 --> 01:50:50.457
That's what the opioid epidemic in America accomplished for them.

01:50:50.938 --> 01:50:53.260
And that's why he will not say it.

01:50:54.417 --> 01:51:03.884
because he is an agent saboteur and he is part of a Trojan horse that's undermining the American government in HHS.

01:51:06.125 --> 01:51:08.287
Last year, did it come back up to 2019 levels?

01:51:09.167 --> 01:51:18.313
In Sweden, the life expectancy dropped in 2020 and then came right back up by 2021, 2022 to the previous trend of increasing life expectancy.

01:51:19.214 --> 01:51:21.676
Whatever those investments we're making as a nation,

01:51:22.842 --> 01:51:37.201
in the research are he's also being really weak in terms of how he's talking about life expectancy because he's not talking about the expected age of death what he's talking about is a trend of increasing life expectancy so in other words

01:51:38.162 --> 01:51:51.012
If life expectancy were to drop from 80 to 72 because of the opioid crisis, and then start going up again, then the trend would be up until, or nowhere until 2019.

01:51:51.072 --> 01:52:01.199
Then the trend would be down for five years, and now the trend is going up again, even though it's now been reduced by, you know, in my example, five or six years.

01:52:03.007 --> 01:52:22.594
So again, he's using his terms and words very cleverly to make sure that he interchanges the idea in your head of what age do we expect people to die, what average age do people die, and the increasing of that number, the slope of the increase of that number.

01:52:23.254 --> 01:52:27.540
I'm going to go back a little bit just to make sure you hear that because it's important.

01:52:27.640 --> 01:52:30.264
He's being disingenuous at best.

01:52:30.684 --> 01:52:34.109
Since 2012, there's been no increase in American life expectancy.

01:52:35.080 --> 01:52:45.803
From 2012 to 2019, literally, it was almost entirely flat life expectancy, whereas the European countries had advances in life expectancy during that period.

01:52:46.383 --> 01:52:53.885
During the pandemic, life expectancy dropped very sharply in the United States, and only just last year did it come back up to 2019 levels.

01:52:54.505 --> 01:52:56.286
I want you to see how malevolent this is.

01:52:58.206 --> 01:52:59.787
You need to see how malevolent it is.

01:52:59.827 --> 01:53:04.489
This is the very first clip of an hour and a half podcast.

01:53:04.569 --> 01:53:08.591
This is the clip that they open with on YouTube.

01:53:08.671 --> 01:53:13.653
So this is the most important message of this podcast.

01:53:14.273 --> 01:53:17.695
Since 2012, there's been no increase in American life expectancy.

01:53:18.683 --> 01:53:29.390
From 2012 to 2019, literally it was almost entirely flat life expectancy, whereas the European countries had advances in life expectancy during that period.

01:53:29.990 --> 01:53:37.495
During the pandemic, life expectancy dropped very sharply in the United States and only just last year did it come back up to 2019 levels.

01:53:38.355 --> 01:53:43.238
In Sweden, the life expectancy dropped in 2020 and then came right back up by 2021, 2022.

01:53:43.298 --> 01:53:45.359
The previous trend of increasing life expectancy.

01:53:48.381 --> 01:54:00.729
Whatever those investments we're making as a nation in the research are not actually translating into meeting the mission of the NIH, which is to advance health and longevity of the American people.

01:54:01.129 --> 01:54:02.550
They kept saying, we don't care.

01:54:03.430 --> 01:54:10.675
And so it's almost like big segments of the public feel like they caught us in something as scientists and we won't admit it.

01:54:11.710 --> 01:54:17.718
And they're not just... So it's first and foremost important to see that it's we against them.

01:54:17.858 --> 01:54:26.069
It's the citizens versus these guys on the same team, which is absurd because this guy is not only a moron, but he's a poser.

01:54:27.153 --> 01:54:29.716
And I didn't see through him at first when he came on YouTube.

01:54:29.736 --> 01:54:30.837
I thought he was really cool.

01:54:30.877 --> 01:54:32.479
I thought he was a cool neuroscientist.

01:54:32.539 --> 01:54:33.900
I thought he was doing cool stuff.

01:54:34.321 --> 01:54:41.708
Remember that the first guy who actually started podcasting on the internet about neuroscience papers and doing Journal Club was yours truly.

01:54:42.109 --> 01:54:45.432
And then this guy started podcasting because I guess they needed some dudes.

01:54:46.914 --> 01:54:49.757
Anyway, he works on vision.

01:54:51.531 --> 01:54:59.475
And in this podcast, my suspicion is that he's going to brag at some point that his research comes all the way from Hubert and Wiesel.

01:55:00.776 --> 01:55:04.958
And they solved, you know, some very basic puzzles in vision.

01:55:04.998 --> 01:55:08.959
And now we're really far along the road of figuring out how vision works.

01:55:09.960 --> 01:55:12.321
And that's a complete bullshit lie.

01:55:12.561 --> 01:55:17.844
It's almost exclusively conjecture based on models that cannot be tested or verified.

01:55:18.780 --> 01:55:23.668
And vision is one of the places where in neuroscience it's gone from bad to worse.

01:55:24.690 --> 01:55:29.057
And maybe vision is where more neuroscience

01:55:29.955 --> 01:55:34.897
work and money has been wasted in vision and in a lot of other places.

01:55:34.957 --> 01:55:47.221
And so it's a very interesting place of all the places that he could have been in neuroscience that they choose this guy to make a super podcast, super podcaster of.

01:55:47.982 --> 01:55:58.906
And the only other guy that Twiv tried to make a super podcaster of is the guy who found the ARC protein being released in exosomes in, or endosomes in the brain.

01:56:00.177 --> 01:56:08.124
So it is without a doubt that these academics are selected for their background and for their playing along.

01:56:08.384 --> 01:56:19.073
This guy is a gigantic ego that will get in the way of him making proper decisions and certainly often gets in the way of him having what you would call principles.

01:56:19.814 --> 01:56:24.818
This guy has all kinds of stories about his infidelity or his, you know, whatever.

01:56:25.099 --> 01:56:25.899
He's a monster.

01:56:25.959 --> 01:56:27.281
This is just a fake man.

01:56:28.163 --> 01:56:34.487
And now he's interviewing another fake man from India, who's currently the head of our NIH, and you should be terrified.

01:56:34.787 --> 01:56:35.307
Pissed off?

01:56:35.347 --> 01:56:36.328
They're kind of like done.

01:56:37.288 --> 01:56:38.189
I hear it all the time.

01:56:38.829 --> 01:56:44.693
And again, this isn't the health and wellness supplement taking, you know, anti-woke crowd.

01:56:44.733 --> 01:56:48.675
This is a big segment of the population that is like, I don't want to hear about it.

01:56:49.115 --> 01:56:51.057
I don't care if labs get funded.

01:56:51.377 --> 01:56:54.178
I want to know why we were lied to or

01:56:55.765 --> 01:56:57.827
The scientific community can't admit fault.

01:56:58.447 --> 01:57:07.674
I just want to land that message for them because in part I'm here for them and get your thoughts on that is so what you think about just that whole act.

01:57:07.834 --> 01:57:10.816
I want to land that message for them because I'm here for them.

01:57:12.197 --> 01:57:13.839
This guy is so gross.

01:57:13.899 --> 01:57:15.480
It's such a terrible script.

01:57:15.780 --> 01:57:20.564
Let's start with lockdowns, masks, and vaccines, just to keep it easy.

01:57:21.505 --> 01:57:28.471
And what do you think the scientific community needs to say in light of those to restore trust?

01:57:28.591 --> 01:57:31.174
Lockdowns, masks, and vaccines.

01:57:34.236 --> 01:57:36.138
All right, Jay, take it away.

01:57:36.879 --> 01:57:41.243
So first, let me just say, I don't think I'm the NIH director, unless that were true.

01:57:41.940 --> 01:57:44.841
unless what you said is true, otherwise I'm not the United States.

01:57:44.861 --> 01:57:58.526
So I was a very vocal advocate against the lockdowns, against the mask mandates, against the vaccine mandates, and against the sort of anti-scientific bent of public health throughout the pandemic.

01:57:59.207 --> 01:58:08.510
I've also argued that the scientific institutions of this country should come clean about our involvement in very dangerous research that potentially caused the pandemic.

01:58:08.830 --> 01:58:10.071
The so-called lab leak hypothesis.

01:58:10.091 --> 01:58:10.191
Yeah.

01:58:10.911 --> 01:58:16.175
Welcome to the Huberman Lab Podcast, where we discuss science and science-based tools for everyday life.

01:58:20.057 --> 01:58:25.741
I'm Andrew Huberman, and I'm a professor of neurobiology and ophthalmology at Stanford School of Medicine.

01:58:26.282 --> 01:58:27.803
My guest today is Dr. Jay Bhattacharya.

01:58:28.956 --> 01:58:34.362
Dr. Jay Bhattacharya is a medical doctor and a PhD and the director of the National Institutes of Health.

01:58:35.083 --> 01:58:38.167
Prior to that, he was a professor of medicine at Stanford University.

01:58:38.547 --> 01:58:45.235
And I should mention that he did all of his formal academic training at Stanford, his undergraduate, master's, PhD, and medical school training.

01:58:45.976 --> 01:58:50.817
Today we discuss the past, the present, and the future of publicly funded research in the United States.

01:58:51.357 --> 01:59:04.881
The National Institutes of Health is considered throughout the world the crown jewel of basic and medical research, explicitly because the basic and clinical research that it has funded has led to more treatments and cures for disease than any other scientific enterprise.

01:59:05.281 --> 01:59:11.123
Basic research is focused on making discoveries without any particular treatment or disease in mind when that work is done.

01:59:11.863 --> 01:59:19.133
It is absolutely clear, however, that basic research provides the knowledge base from which all treatments and cures for diseases are eventually made.

01:59:19.534 --> 01:59:27.124
Today, Dr. Bhattacharya shares his vision of which aspects of NIH are especially effective and which need revising and improvement.

01:59:27.665 --> 01:59:36.212
We discuss how scientific ideas are evaluated for funding and what can be done to create more funding for more ambitious projects leading to treatments and cures.

01:59:36.633 --> 01:59:47.402
This is a very timely issue because despite its strengths, the NIH has gained a reputation over the last two decades for favoring safer and less bold work and therefore leading to more discoveries.

01:59:47.862 --> 01:59:49.503
We also discuss what will be done about the.

01:59:51.321 --> 01:59:55.825
The replication crisis is, as the name suggests, the inability for certain findings to be replicated.

01:59:55.845 --> 02:00:04.954
Dr. Bhattacharya shares with us new initiatives, soon to take place, that are designed to verify findings early and to incentivize replication so the knowledge base built by NIH science is accurate.

02:00:05.255 --> 02:00:13.363
As some of you may know, Dr. Bhattacharya stepped into a very public role during the COVID-19 pandemic when he co-authored the so-called Great Barrington Declaration, which argued against lockdowns.

02:00:13.803 --> 02:00:15.404
He was also quite vocal against mask mandates.

02:00:16.144 --> 02:00:27.069
Don't forget that he also authored three separate seroprevalence studies and seeded the narrative about seroprevalence being a way of tracking the virus and showing previous exposure to it.

02:00:27.609 --> 02:00:31.190
And he was one of the foremost authorities on that at the beginning of the pandemic.

02:00:31.230 --> 02:00:35.152
Again, remember all evidence of the virus comes from Indians.

02:00:37.008 --> 02:00:39.690
address vaccine efficacy versus safety, especially for young people.

02:00:40.171 --> 02:00:44.274
Those stances, of course, were very controversial, and he explains the logic for his stance on those topics.

02:00:44.534 --> 02:00:49.658
That discussion leads into a very direct conversation about vaccines more generally, not just COVID-19 vaccines, but also measles.

02:00:49.698 --> 02:00:55.643
I'm glad more people are seeing that this guy is reading a teleprompter and that makes him pathetic.

02:00:56.064 --> 02:00:57.485
Thank you very much for seeing that.

02:00:58.499 --> 02:01:03.386
months, rubella vaccines, and the very public and controversial issue taking place right now about vaccines and autism.

02:01:03.646 --> 02:01:10.215
We also discussed drug prices and why Americans pay 10 times or more for the same prescription drugs sold in other countries and the relationship of that to public health.

02:01:10.475 --> 02:01:13.339
I want to emphasize that the issues we discuss today will impact everybody.

02:01:13.800 --> 02:01:15.462
If you're a scientist, they certainly impact you.

02:01:15.842 --> 02:01:17.343
If you're a physician, they impact you.

02:01:17.664 --> 02:01:23.429
And if you're young, if you're old, if you're a patient, if you're healthy, if you're American, or if you're outside the United States, they will impact you.

02:01:23.770 --> 02:01:29.415
Dr. Bhattacharya was incredibly generous with his time and his answers, directly answering every single question I asked, nothing was cut.

02:01:29.695 --> 02:01:37.243
As a consequence, it's a lengthy podcast, but I felt it was very important to get into the nuance of these issues so that you, the listener, can get real clarity on where things stand and where they are headed.

02:01:37.583 --> 02:01:45.752
As a final point, my graduate student training, my postdoctoral training, and my laboratory, first at the University of California, San Diego, and then at Stanford, where it is now, were funded by the NIH.

02:01:46.132 --> 02:01:49.115
So you'll notice throughout today's episode that I'm very impassioned by the issues at hand.

02:01:49.495 --> 02:01:54.661
At the same time, I strive to include questions that I keep hearing from my followers on social media and from listeners of the Huberman Lab podcast.

02:01:55.021 --> 02:01:59.923
Some of those come from ardent supporters of the NIH, and others, as you'll see, are more skeptical or even critical of the NIH.

02:02:00.304 --> 02:02:02.605
I strive to represent all those voices during today's conversation.

02:02:02.845 --> 02:02:09.148
I certainly have my own opinions and stance on many of those issues, and I do voice some of those throughout today's episode, but again, I try to be thorough and broad-encompassing.

02:02:09.588 --> 02:02:14.310
As you'll see, Dr. Bhattacharya cares deeply about basic science and the future of medicine and health in this country and throughout the world.

02:02:14.691 --> 02:02:17.052
He is our appointment on these literal science and science.

02:02:17.072 --> 02:02:18.232
Hey, Bhattacharya, welcome.

02:02:18.272 --> 02:02:19.133
I couldn't do it anymore.

02:02:19.753 --> 02:02:21.214
I've been wanting to do this for a very long time.

02:02:21.234 --> 02:02:27.096
We are colleagues at Stanford, although now you've formally moved to Washington to be the director of the National Institutes of Health.

02:02:27.736 --> 02:02:34.939
But you played such an essential role in shining a light on certain aspects of public health, mostly that happened during the time of the pandemic.

02:02:35.279 --> 02:02:37.600
He spent a lot of time

02:02:38.604 --> 02:02:45.211
reinforcing the narrative, and he has also been paid to reinforce the narrative of flu and reinforce the narrative of AIDS.

02:02:45.311 --> 02:02:47.032
Just make sure you understand that.

02:02:47.093 --> 02:02:49.955
That is his professional background.

02:02:50.636 --> 02:02:52.318
Related to lockdowns, vaccines, et cetera.

02:02:52.358 --> 02:02:52.898
We'll talk about that.

02:02:52.938 --> 02:03:02.148
But now you are in the chief position of directing research dollars and the initiatives of what is arguably the most important health organization in the entire world, not just in the United States.

02:03:02.901 --> 02:03:04.042
So thank you for taking the position.

02:03:04.162 --> 02:03:04.903
Thank you for being here.

02:03:04.923 --> 02:03:15.090
And the first question I have is, for those that are not familiar, what is the, not just stated mission of the NIH, but what is the really essential mission of the National Institutes of Health?

02:03:15.310 --> 02:03:18.533
So let me start with the stated mission, because the stated mission is something entirely worthwhile.

02:03:19.634 --> 02:03:21.535
Anyone who listens to it should say, yeah, we should do this.

02:03:22.076 --> 02:03:26.559
It is to support research that advances the health and longevity of the American people.

02:03:26.919 --> 02:03:31.583
And of course, the research that we do doesn't just advance American health, it advances the health of the entire world.

02:03:32.043 --> 02:03:41.406
For a very long time, the NIH, the National Institute of Health, has been the premier biomedical organization supporting research that translates into almost every drug that you take.

02:03:41.766 --> 02:03:43.206
The NIH has had some role in developing.

02:03:43.586 --> 02:03:50.528
I can hear something in the background that sounds like they have altered his voice to sound deeper, and it's bothering me a lot.

02:03:50.728 --> 02:03:52.349
I can hear like a second voice.

02:03:52.409 --> 02:03:53.089
Can you hear that?

02:03:54.465 --> 02:04:20.079
The other thing I want to say is that because the NIH is the NIH, and it's actually in disguise, just the Human Genome Project, if you look at all of the grant calls at a 30,000 foot perspective, you will see that the NIH is exclusively focused on genetic disorders, genetic mechanisms, molecular mechanisms, inheritance, all of the things, development, that

02:04:21.004 --> 02:04:39.938
belie that the overarching goal set is the Human Genome Project, which necessarily, by definition, if you're following along, has to be that the entire population of the United States becomes willing experimental animals.

02:04:40.398 --> 02:04:44.021
It doesn't just advance American health, it advances the health of the entire world.

02:04:44.481 --> 02:04:53.787
For a very long time, the NIH, the National Institute of Health, has been the premier biomedical organization supporting research that translates into almost every drug that you take.

02:04:54.147 --> 02:04:59.331
The NIH has had some role in developing almost every, you know, all the fights over what's the right thing to do.

02:04:59.671 --> 02:05:07.056
I almost have to slow it back down because I hear something there that's bothering me.

02:05:07.136 --> 02:05:08.537
It's really bothering me a lot.

02:05:08.697 --> 02:05:11.118
I don't know why it's bothering me, but it's really bothering me.

02:05:11.839 --> 02:05:13.480
No, I want you to be small.

02:05:17.668 --> 02:05:22.550
Sorry, this is very hard to coordinate on my screens for reasons that you don't need to understand.

02:05:23.250 --> 02:05:31.293
I'm going to set this back to 1 and see if I can still hear the background noise, the voice thing.

02:05:34.707 --> 02:05:38.389
do to get good sleep, what's the right thing to do for your diet.

02:05:38.409 --> 02:05:39.669
The NIH has played some role.

02:05:40.470 --> 02:05:44.632
And for American Biomedicine, it's the essential institution.

02:05:45.412 --> 02:05:50.414
It supports the careers of a very large number of biomedical scientists around the world.

02:05:51.355 --> 02:05:55.277
And specifically, I'm going to go so far as to say that I can hear it really easy.

02:05:55.357 --> 02:05:58.198
That guy's voice is, they're adding depth to it.

02:05:58.298 --> 02:05:58.778
It's deep.

02:05:59.519 --> 02:06:01.079
There's like an extra voice there.

02:06:01.099 --> 02:06:02.020
And if I sped it up,

02:06:02.640 --> 02:06:04.922
It was easier for me to separate it from his voice.

02:06:04.962 --> 02:06:07.203
But if I put it at normal speed, it's harder to hear.

02:06:07.743 --> 02:06:08.564
But I think it's there.

02:06:08.584 --> 02:06:09.805
Particularly me.

02:06:09.965 --> 02:06:13.407
I mean, I got NIH funding for most of my career.

02:06:13.747 --> 02:06:18.770
I was a reviewer for the NIH, a scientific reviewer for grants.

02:06:19.430 --> 02:06:21.031
It's an absolutely essential organization.

02:06:21.952 --> 02:06:22.332
I agree.

02:06:22.372 --> 02:06:22.773
My lab.

02:06:24.415 --> 02:06:26.356
ran on NIH money primarily.

02:06:27.056 --> 02:06:29.138
So thank you, taxpayers, American taxpayers.

02:06:29.738 --> 02:06:44.226
And I think for most people, when they hear that word health and what you just said about the mission statement for NIH, there is this assumption that most of the work being done at or funded by NIH is- You want to hear something crazy?

02:06:45.166 --> 02:06:46.367
or even mouse study.

02:06:46.407 --> 02:06:47.649
They're at Stanford, right?

02:06:47.749 --> 02:06:55.616
There's a girl that's a full professor in neuroscience in his department, a woman by the name of Lisa Giacomo.

02:06:56.817 --> 02:07:03.343
And I don't want anybody to bother Lisa Giacomo, but Lisa Giacomo knows who I am because we did a postdoc together in Norway.

02:07:05.706 --> 02:07:07.908
She worked with the Mosers when I worked with the Mosers.

02:07:10.899 --> 02:07:22.863
Actually, her PhD supervisor, Mike Hasselboe, also knows me very well, and I think had a great deal of respect for me as a neuroscientist and an experimentalist while I was still doing the rounds.

02:07:23.983 --> 02:07:26.984
And so this guy, I mean, I'm really close to these people.

02:07:29.011 --> 02:07:32.213
Lisa Giacomo would definitely know who Jonathan Cui is.

02:07:32.833 --> 02:07:41.037
And if she found out that I had become an anti-vaxxer or something like that, and was working with Bobby Kennedy, she would write me off because I was working with Bobby Kennedy.

02:07:42.798 --> 02:07:44.659
Because I was working with Kevin McCairn.

02:07:44.940 --> 02:07:47.441
Because I was working with Children's Health Defense.

02:07:47.501 --> 02:07:49.362
She would write me off immediately.

02:07:50.643 --> 02:07:53.204
And in retrospect, with very good reason, right?

02:07:54.673 --> 02:08:05.877
And so what they have effectively done is taken somebody who has colleagues on faculties all around the world and done their best to associate these fools with me.

02:08:06.797 --> 02:08:15.321
From Kevin McKernan, to Kevin McCairn, to Steve Kirsch, to Robert Malone, all the way up to Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

02:08:15.361 --> 02:08:21.763
himself, who, despite what seems to be shooting himself in the foot and this whole movement in the foot, put me in that book.

02:08:26.796 --> 02:08:36.481
One of my postdoctoral colleagues is a full professor colleague of these two people at Stanford.

02:08:36.781 --> 02:08:37.962
Understand that.

02:08:41.104 --> 02:08:45.626
Is that are testing a particular drug, a dose response curve, you know, what's the lethal dose of this?

02:08:45.746 --> 02:08:46.827
What's the half-life of that?

02:08:47.587 --> 02:08:50.369
But as you and I both know, much of what NIH does

02:08:51.281 --> 02:08:53.242
is fund basic research.

02:08:53.963 --> 02:09:02.647
Research for which we don't have any clear idea, maybe even the foggiest of ideas, that there could be a potential upside for human health.

02:09:03.067 --> 02:09:09.211
Things like what controls the pigmentation patterns of the noses of Doberman Pinscher dogs.

02:09:09.551 --> 02:09:11.272
And how would you research that?

02:09:12.072 --> 02:09:14.373
I don't think that that's really a research grant.

02:09:14.393 --> 02:09:17.135
I think he pulled that out of the air and he did it very poorly.

02:09:18.305 --> 02:09:21.552
But how about making knockout mice that we don't even know if they matter or not?

02:09:24.977 --> 02:09:28.099
How about trying to make mouse models of human diseases?

02:09:28.239 --> 02:09:30.281
These are the kinds of things he should be bringing up.

02:09:30.361 --> 02:09:32.603
Not that hypothetical that was as dumb as a rock.

02:09:32.623 --> 02:09:34.224
I bet you we could find that grant.

02:09:34.884 --> 02:09:36.445
So when we, maybe not.

02:09:36.525 --> 02:09:39.207
I bet you can't, you jackass.

02:09:39.468 --> 02:09:39.828
Anymore.

02:09:40.168 --> 02:09:47.994
But when we step back and we look at basic versus applied, aka clinical research, what percentage of the NIH.

02:09:48.014 --> 02:09:50.415
This is such a fake person, it's kind of scary.

02:09:50.516 --> 02:09:52.377
NIH budget, which we'll talk about in a moment.

02:09:52.768 --> 02:10:04.013
is directed toward basic research and what percentage is directed toward clinical studies or the testing of some drug, what we call preclinical trials, testing in mice.

02:10:04.533 --> 02:10:08.395
What difference does it make how much money is in those books under those different rubrics?

02:10:08.495 --> 02:10:13.917
What difference does that, how is that gonna progress this narrative of whatever he's trying to get at?

02:10:13.977 --> 02:10:16.198
Think about how stupid that is for an opening.

02:10:16.558 --> 02:10:18.699
So we're non-human primates, et cetera.

02:10:19.161 --> 02:10:23.683
So there's big fights over exactly what that demarcation line is, so I'm not going to commit to a single number.

02:10:24.164 --> 02:10:30.547
What I will say is that a substantial part of the NIH portfolio appropriately focuses on basic science.

02:10:30.927 --> 02:10:46.336
Basic science meaning fundamental biological facts that can be used in many, many, many... There's a huge emphasis on patentable ideas and patentable items and things, concepts.

02:10:47.908 --> 02:10:55.631
All the faculties around the United States and all the grant committees around the United States really love it if there's going to be some kind of patent that comes out of your work.

02:10:56.551 --> 02:10:59.192
I don't think he's going to say anything about intellectual property here.

02:10:59.572 --> 02:11:09.956
Drug studies, other research where you don't necessarily know specifically in advance when you're doing it what the applications are going to be.

02:11:11.044 --> 02:11:17.194
The NIH very appropriately funds that work, especially work that's not patentable, right?

02:11:17.234 --> 02:11:20.900
Because no drug company has an incentive to do that work.

02:11:21.421 --> 02:11:22.643
Wow, that's remarkable.

02:11:22.724 --> 02:11:23.926
I did not, I haven't watched this.

02:11:25.359 --> 02:11:29.122
The fact that that's coming out, just as I say that, that is pure luck.

02:11:29.182 --> 02:11:31.464
I know it's hard to believe, but it is really pure luck.

02:11:31.684 --> 02:11:32.445
And yet it's vital.

02:11:32.585 --> 02:11:44.035
Just let me give an example, just to put some meat on the bone of it, of something that the NIH didn't fund, but actually is within the mission of the NIH to have funded if it had.

02:11:44.736 --> 02:11:50.461
Let's just take the research that led to the understanding of the structure of DNA as a double helix.

02:11:51.241 --> 02:11:58.003
Matt Watson, Crick, Rosalind Franklin, all those folks in England in the 1950s.

02:11:59.083 --> 02:12:01.844
Well, that work is not patentable.

02:12:02.044 --> 02:12:08.285
It's hard to imagine someone trying to patent the double helix structure of DNA, right?

02:12:08.826 --> 02:12:13.707
I don't think this is a very good discussion about what's patentable and what's not.

02:12:13.867 --> 02:12:17.268
I think that this is the biggest bullshit show ever.

02:12:18.840 --> 02:12:23.146
Is he going to get to the Yale Law Review about the antibody patent paradox?

02:12:23.807 --> 02:12:36.203
Is he going to get to the idea that intellectual property is currently allowed in the form of a PCR diagnostic, even though we have never evaluated any of those things as medical devices?

02:12:39.332 --> 02:12:46.838
So that means that it's not going to be in the interest of any specific company to support those scientists that discovered that.

02:12:47.278 --> 02:12:49.901
And yet it's vital to almost everything we do in biology.

02:12:51.314 --> 02:12:58.458
The NIH very appropriately funds that kind of work, the work that is not in the interest of any particular company to do.

02:12:58.558 --> 02:13:01.240
It solves a market failure, if you think like an economist.

02:13:02.621 --> 02:13:09.985
The market failure is there's no incentive of the private sector to do that kind of basic work, and yet that basic work really advances human health.

02:13:10.525 --> 02:13:12.507
in ways that are sometimes unpredictable.

02:13:13.488 --> 02:13:28.122
And so it's correct and right that the NIH continues to fund that kind of basic science work, as well as the applied work, where you take the advances and say, OK, well, here's a drug that might work to treat this disease.

02:13:28.162 --> 02:13:30.344
That kind of work also is appropriate for the NIH to fund.

02:13:33.547 --> 02:13:38.429
dividing line where the question is like, what should be left to the private sector to do?

02:13:39.150 --> 02:13:46.253
So the private sector tends to fund large-scale clinical trials at sort of the tail end of the development process.

02:13:47.394 --> 02:13:50.355
Sometimes they'll fund earlier clinical trials.

02:13:51.116 --> 02:13:54.858
But the private sector has an incentive

02:13:55.658 --> 02:14:00.583
to fund those kinds of studies because that gives them exclusivity, patents, things.

02:14:00.643 --> 02:14:06.208
So why should the taxpayer pay for that when there's already private actors that are willing to pay for that?

02:14:06.608 --> 02:14:08.810
There's this interesting dividing line.

02:14:09.931 --> 02:14:13.714
You want the NIH work to be translated so that patients can have it.

02:14:13.754 --> 02:14:15.536
That means the private sector has to be involved.

02:14:15.556 --> 02:14:16.517
Okay, this is dumb.

02:14:16.557 --> 02:14:17.277
I'm going forward.

02:14:18.178 --> 02:14:30.666
As I said earlier, they're a huge, almost religious horse over where that thing, which is we have to fund basic work, separation of vision, and blinding diseases like glaucoma, related to anxiety, et cetera.

02:14:31.026 --> 02:14:33.508
I also know that, but I worked on clinically.

02:14:33.628 --> 02:14:37.830
But the fundamental thing, which is we have to fund basic work, that I believe in pretty strongly.

02:14:39.602 --> 02:14:49.146
Basic scientist, I'm not a clinician, but I worked on clinically relevant issues in my lab related to restoration of vision and blinding diseases like glaucoma.

02:14:50.186 --> 02:14:52.247
Restoration of vision.

02:14:52.507 --> 02:14:53.267
Stop lying.

02:14:54.348 --> 02:14:56.489
Stop lying.

02:14:56.509 --> 02:15:00.430
Is restoration of vision something you can work on, kind of like, you know, Neuralink?

02:15:01.451 --> 02:15:02.251
No, it's not.

02:15:03.616 --> 02:15:11.842
restoration of vision what a jackass okay even just to say that that's like saying that you work on autism because you work on some mice

02:15:16.021 --> 02:15:17.922
He's got a mouse model for glaucoma.

02:15:18.002 --> 02:15:18.422
Oh boy.

02:15:18.482 --> 02:15:20.463
He's sure solving all the problems, man.

02:15:20.523 --> 02:15:21.424
He's just the man.

02:15:21.624 --> 02:15:22.964
Related to anxiety, et cetera.

02:15:23.325 --> 02:15:27.247
I also know that vision problems related to anxiety again.

02:15:27.327 --> 02:15:27.667
Why?

02:15:28.127 --> 02:15:36.151
Because there are grant calls from the fricking NIH to find genes associated with fricking anxiety.

02:15:39.062 --> 02:15:42.564
His research is influenced, is not funded by the NIH.

02:15:42.864 --> 02:15:49.026
It's defined by the NIH because he writes grants that fit the calls of the NIH.

02:15:49.446 --> 02:15:56.489
He hasn't designed his own experiment in probably since his PhD when somebody else gave him a project.

02:15:56.630 --> 02:15:57.550
This is a joke.

02:15:58.530 --> 02:15:59.931
This is an awful fraud.

02:16:01.229 --> 02:16:09.954
We have some beautiful cases, as you pointed out, of basic research leading to important, I will say, cures to serious diseases.

02:16:10.594 --> 02:16:12.275
And there was no thought at the beginning.

02:16:12.315 --> 02:16:13.436
Serious diseases.

02:16:13.496 --> 02:16:14.717
What are serious diseases?

02:16:14.757 --> 02:16:16.438
They're the same as rare diseases.

02:16:16.498 --> 02:16:23.822
They're diseases defined by a protein malfunction, malfolding, absence phenotype.

02:16:25.742 --> 02:16:35.107
They're the only low-hanging fruit in biology that we can use to feign progress in our genetic understanding of ourselves.

02:16:36.388 --> 02:16:47.194
It's the only way that we can claim that we're working on all of these questions, is if we find an example of a rare disease, a protein that is incorrect or missing,

02:16:48.621 --> 02:16:56.504
and then try to solve that puzzle by understanding what that gene does based on the phenotype not being lethal.

02:16:57.925 --> 02:17:07.048
Because lethal phenotypes, where you're missing a protein, aren't really useful for understanding the biology that we don't get, the irreducible complexity of ourselves.

02:17:07.708 --> 02:17:11.350
We only have a chance at these low-hanging fruit

02:17:12.247 --> 02:17:19.212
where there's a single gene that seems to be off and it has a single phenotype that's replicable, that shows up all the time.

02:17:19.573 --> 02:17:21.194
That's what a rare disease is.

02:17:24.376 --> 02:17:27.699
That's what genetic knockout mice recapitulate.

02:17:29.841 --> 02:17:37.707
They're creating a situation that is so rare in order to try and study

02:17:39.269 --> 02:17:40.670
something it's really not related.

02:17:40.730 --> 02:17:46.472
It's like an anecdotal example of how something doesn't quite go in the right trajectory across time.

02:17:47.493 --> 02:17:51.875
And then claiming that by understanding that you understand everything or soon will.

02:17:52.475 --> 02:17:57.137
Beginning of that basic research that the outcome would be related to human health.

02:17:57.177 --> 02:17:58.638
I'll just briefly mention a couple.

02:17:59.618 --> 02:18:05.881
I wanna ask more questions than I wanna speak, but my scientific great-grandparents, David Hubel and Torsten Wiesel,

02:18:06.926 --> 02:18:09.888
did the early work to find... I told you he would say them.

02:18:10.228 --> 02:18:10.828
They have to.

02:18:11.048 --> 02:18:13.309
They always have to tell you where they come from.

02:18:14.350 --> 02:18:15.631
They always have to tell you that.

02:18:16.231 --> 02:18:17.492
And that makes them legit.

02:18:17.872 --> 02:18:20.373
My scientific great-grandfathers.

02:18:20.653 --> 02:18:21.354
Stop lying!

02:18:21.894 --> 02:18:32.200
Then I get to claim Erwin, Erwin Nair and Burt Sackman as my just-grandfathers because everybody that I did postdocs with studied with them.

02:18:33.120 --> 02:18:34.321
I'm not for

02:18:35.759 --> 02:18:40.591
four apprenticeships away from my great-great-grandfather in neuroscience.

02:18:40.711 --> 02:18:42.195
I'm only one apprenticeship away.

02:18:42.950 --> 02:18:43.851
And I had dinner with him.

02:18:44.912 --> 02:18:53.019
Structure and function of the visual system, first in cats, then in monkeys, eventually it was clear the same was true of their findings in human work.

02:18:53.579 --> 02:19:03.888
And early plasticity, changes in the visual system of say there was a cataract or a droopy eyelid or divergent eyes, strabismus or convergent, you know, so what we call cross-eyedness and things of that sort.

02:19:04.328 --> 02:19:06.170
And we know on the basis of that work,

02:19:07.079 --> 02:19:18.029
that children need corrective surgeries early or else the brain is forever blind to the perfectly fine eyeball if the eyes aren't correctly aligned, okay?

02:19:18.049 --> 02:19:22.774
In other words, the old practice of, oh, you don't want to put kids under anesthesia, it's too risky, et cetera.

02:19:23.234 --> 02:19:25.557
So make no mistake about it.

02:19:25.637 --> 02:19:28.539
There are mechanical aspects to the eye.

02:19:29.700 --> 02:19:31.702
There are mechanical aspects to vision.

02:19:32.853 --> 02:19:39.121
And so those mechanisms, those mechanics can go off, can be off, can be off in development.

02:19:39.161 --> 02:19:50.036
The trajectory across time can lead to maladaptive visual system and the physics and mechanics of the visual system can be misaligned.

02:19:51.237 --> 02:19:54.780
That doesn't mean that now we can understand the whole body as a meat puppet.

02:19:55.341 --> 02:20:09.973
It doesn't mean that we now understand by, this is actually one of the reasons why vision has been so exploited in neuroscience because it has this illusion that it's just a mechanic mechanics.

02:20:10.073 --> 02:20:15.238
And, and it's, and that mechanics part is a, is a firm handhold that we can hold onto.

02:20:15.999 --> 02:20:17.180
We can track their eyes.

02:20:20.071 --> 02:20:23.573
This illusion is ubiquitous.

02:20:23.733 --> 02:20:29.356
This acceptance of this knowledge is ubiquitous throughout neuroscience.

02:20:29.417 --> 02:20:30.077
Again, why?

02:20:30.517 --> 02:20:41.704
Because neuroscientists that don't work on vision are taught through their whole career not to really question anybody else's work and assume that they're just doing things as best as they can, just like you are.

02:20:42.654 --> 02:20:51.539
even though in visual science they use all kinds of measurements and correlations and models of measurements and correlations that have no bearing in reality.

02:20:52.779 --> 02:21:02.704
They're just simplifying an irreducibly complex problem into something stupid enough that they can claim that they succeeded, that they're making measurements.

02:21:05.826 --> 02:21:09.388
This is a master charlatan and probably also an unwitting one.

02:21:09.448 --> 02:21:11.709
He doesn't know how bad

02:21:12.847 --> 02:21:14.108
visual science is.

02:21:14.228 --> 02:21:17.051
Like a lot of them, most of them don't, otherwise you can't make it.

02:21:18.472 --> 02:21:23.337
The work of Hubel and Wiesel saved the vision of millions and millions of children in the U.S.

02:21:23.377 --> 02:21:23.878
and abroad.

02:21:24.318 --> 02:21:27.101
People with cataract have those cataracts removed early and on and on.

02:21:27.281 --> 02:21:35.529
And I would also say as a second example that much of the basic work on cell biology that took place in the second half of the last century, you know,

02:21:35.899 --> 02:21:36.880
Where are the mitochondria?

02:21:36.920 --> 02:21:37.941
What's in the mitochondria?

02:21:37.961 --> 02:21:39.142
Electron microscopy lights.

02:21:39.222 --> 02:21:41.684
Let's talk about all the folds in the mitochondria.

02:21:41.704 --> 02:21:45.207
Let's talk about- Mitochondria, mitochondria, mitochondria.

02:21:45.227 --> 02:21:46.428
What is he talking about?

02:21:48.310 --> 02:21:49.451
This is just bullshit.

02:21:49.551 --> 02:21:52.033
It's very disingenuous because he's lying.

02:21:52.473 --> 02:22:02.342
And you can go back to all of his previous work from before this year or before maybe the end of last year, and you'll never hear him mention mitochondria even once.

02:22:04.500 --> 02:22:09.582
Go back to 2020 and look at his podcast, see if he ever mentions mitochondria, the folds in them.

02:22:13.663 --> 02:22:24.387
All that basic cellular biology, that is the stuff of textbooks, was, as we say, necessary, perhaps not sufficient, but necessary for the development of essentially every existing cancer treatment.

02:22:25.227 --> 02:22:30.049
But the cell biologists that did that work weren't thinking about cancer until much later in that work.

02:22:30.089 --> 02:22:32.089
So those are just two examples.

02:22:32.449 --> 02:22:33.810
Gosh, that is awful.

02:22:35.287 --> 02:22:36.888
He is really awful.

02:22:38.029 --> 02:22:46.897
I mean, as a pure biologist, this guy is such a fraud, he's actually just read a few things and assumed he knows.

02:22:47.158 --> 02:22:49.920
That I would argue NIH had funded a tremendous amount of.

02:22:50.220 --> 02:23:00.810
And the reason I'm setting it up this way is because I think nowadays, part of the reason you're here, is that we are potentially looking at a redirecting of a significant amount of the

02:23:01.365 --> 02:23:11.492
research dollars that taxpayers provide to the NIH and the NIH to labs away from basic research, which understandably has some people concerned.

02:23:12.753 --> 02:23:20.638
That said, in order to translate things from the lab to the clinic, we also need to think about translational work.

02:23:20.658 --> 02:23:22.539
So I just put that out as kind of an offering

02:23:23.215 --> 02:23:23.816
to elaborate.

02:23:24.036 --> 02:23:36.284
Andrew, I have no intention of implementing that, of shifting the balance between, I think, as I said, basic science work and applied work are both tremendously important parts of the NIH portfolio.

02:23:36.685 --> 02:23:49.113
And the question to me is what's scientifically important and interesting in terms of accomplishing the NIH mission, which is, again, advancing the health and longevity of the American people.

02:23:50.919 --> 02:23:56.722
basic work and applied work can contribute to that mission.

02:23:57.082 --> 02:24:08.868
And in fact, I think any large-scale scientific institution that seeks to support the mission that the NIH has, has to have both in it.

02:24:09.208 --> 02:24:12.110
So I don't have any intention of gutting basic science.

02:24:12.130 --> 02:24:18.193
I mean, I personally, I do epidemiology, health policies, health economics, statistics.

02:24:19.273 --> 02:24:20.414
That's very, very applied.

02:24:21.094 --> 02:24:25.516
But I have great admiration for my colleagues like you who do basic science work.

02:24:25.536 --> 02:24:28.958
I think it's what advances and fuels the next generation of advances.

02:24:29.938 --> 02:24:34.220
So it's going to stay part of the NIH mission as long as I'm the director.

02:24:34.560 --> 02:24:34.941
Thank you.

02:24:35.101 --> 02:24:37.982
I and many others will be very relieved to hear that answer.

02:24:38.442 --> 02:24:46.606
I think there is this fear that the new administration is going to eliminate basic research somehow and replace it with only applied research and clinical studies.

02:24:46.946 --> 02:24:50.188
and that somehow, and this is not my- That's an irrelevant question.

02:24:50.249 --> 02:24:52.070
The whole debate is so stupid.

02:24:52.190 --> 02:24:54.532
It's just a hamster wheel of bullshit.

02:24:55.172 --> 02:24:56.093
It is awful.

02:24:56.133 --> 02:25:03.538
I believe that there's going to be some private interests related to that, and it's all going to get co-opted in some kind of cloudy way.

02:25:03.999 --> 02:25:07.261
What I'm hearing from you is that is not the direction that NIH is going to take.

02:25:07.781 --> 02:25:12.864
In fact, I've not heard anyone inside the administration tell me to do that or suggest that as the appropriate path.

02:25:12.944 --> 02:25:19.268
I just, I mean, everyone I've spoken to about my vision has said yes.

02:25:19.588 --> 02:25:21.569
What's your vision, you traitor?

02:25:21.589 --> 02:25:23.890
You fake person.

02:25:23.950 --> 02:25:24.871
What's your vision?

02:25:25.871 --> 02:25:26.311
Makes sense.

02:25:26.952 --> 02:25:27.172
Great.

02:25:28.939 --> 02:25:32.160
I'd like to take a quick break and acknowledge one of our sponsors, David.

02:25:49.646 --> 02:25:54.111
is a very important issue, which is this notion of IDC, indirect costs.

02:25:54.671 --> 02:26:00.957
So my lab ran on NIH grants for many years, and my lab and other labs would apply.

02:26:01.417 --> 02:26:03.399
Indirect costs are the 150% on top.

02:26:03.419 --> 02:26:03.760
So basically,

02:26:08.324 --> 02:26:25.478
My primary investigator that provided the funding or stewarded the funding of a lab that I would be a postdoc in or in the case of Brian Hooks at the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine, we got an R01 because I got a bunch of data in my first year working for him.

02:26:25.538 --> 02:26:29.261
His R01 got funded and then he's paying my salary with his R01.

02:26:30.022 --> 02:26:35.366
That R01 has to pay my salary plus about 50% on top to the university.

02:26:36.303 --> 02:26:46.236
so that my salary can be paid plus the rent on my office and the rent on the animal facility and the rent on our laboratory space, that's all rented.

02:26:50.823 --> 02:27:07.337
A tenure track professor at the University of Pittsburgh and most other universities is essentially running a very small business that runs on grant applications alone, or grant funding alone, and maybe some other foundational money and stuff like that, and then they pay bills with it.

02:27:08.058 --> 02:27:15.765
They pay bills to an animal facility, they pay bills to suppliers, and they pay bills to the university that hosts them.

02:27:16.545 --> 02:27:17.306
They pay rent.

02:27:18.311 --> 02:27:22.933
And they pay for the health care and for the salary of their employees.

02:27:22.993 --> 02:27:26.074
It's all just one big pyramid.

02:27:27.575 --> 02:27:33.197
And somewhere in the middle, shitty part of the pyramid, is where that primary investigator finds themselves.

02:27:34.237 --> 02:27:36.538
They are paying the salary of the

02:27:37.188 --> 02:27:38.009
Department head.

02:27:38.129 --> 02:27:44.772
The department head at the Department of Neurobiology at the University of Pittsburgh is named Peter Strick.

02:27:45.293 --> 02:27:47.594
And Peter Strick is a longtime monkey guy.

02:27:48.274 --> 02:27:52.056
When I left Pitt in 2021 or 20, he was being paid $508,000 a year as salary.

02:27:52.076 --> 02:27:53.737
Now that might surprise some of you.

02:27:53.757 --> 02:27:54.658
You might not realize that

02:28:02.657 --> 02:28:05.999
professors at a university that barely do any experiments anymore.

02:28:06.039 --> 02:28:12.882
They just kind of hire postdocs and let them go are making $500,000 a year.

02:28:13.342 --> 02:28:18.485
They are spending their time and their money on season tickets to the college basketball season.

02:28:19.065 --> 02:28:26.009
And they are getting roughly one house in Pittsburgh equivalent per year plus salary.

02:28:28.888 --> 02:28:34.731
And you're not aware that the assistant provost to the dean and all these other people are all making six-figure salaries.

02:28:34.771 --> 02:28:45.315
They all are making six-figure salaries because the NIH provides indirect cost funding, which is a super scam.

02:28:46.075 --> 02:28:54.319
And so now these guys are gonna say, yeah, but these are all, you know, essential employees and essential parts of what the, the university is a scam.

02:28:55.438 --> 02:29:07.044
Because in any other real organization that was really doing something good, nobody would be getting paid $2 million a year to be the dean of a medical school.

02:29:07.124 --> 02:29:13.848
Nobody would be getting paid $508,000 a year to be chair of a neurobiology department over Zoom.

02:29:16.069 --> 02:29:18.491
That's what's happening just at the University of Pittsburgh.

02:29:18.531 --> 02:29:20.292
And I assure you, Stanford is worse.

02:29:20.932 --> 02:29:23.994
Stanford has a whole banking,

02:29:25.461 --> 02:29:33.744
little organization that helps people buy property when they get tenure because it's so hard to buy anything there.

02:29:33.824 --> 02:29:38.606
They actually have a whole program to help their faculty be able to afford to live.

02:29:41.206 --> 02:29:43.207
And that's all provided by an endowment.

02:29:44.087 --> 02:29:49.388
All of these big universities have giant weaponized piles of money from which they draw.

02:29:51.449 --> 02:29:53.169
That's on top of and instead of.

02:29:53.229 --> 02:29:59.511
And besides, the huge amount of grant money that they bring in are allowed to charge indirect costs of up to 155%.

02:30:04.175 --> 02:30:08.477
This is a giant scam, and now these two guys are gonna agree that, ah, that's crazy.

02:30:08.877 --> 02:30:11.578
These people just don't understand what indirect costs are.

02:30:11.818 --> 02:30:13.959
I do, I understand it very well.

02:30:14.639 --> 02:30:22.943
And it results in a lot of overpaid bureaucratic members of a university, all the deans, all the provosts, all that shit.

02:30:24.872 --> 02:30:35.135
for grants, if we were fortunate enough to get one of those grants funded, we might receive, let's say, a typical grant would be a million dollars over the course of four years, so 250 a year for four years.

02:30:36.075 --> 02:30:45.237
But then in addition to that, my home university, Stanford, would get some percentage above that, not a percentage of that million.

02:30:45.297 --> 02:30:50.038
I would still get the million to spend on mice, antibodies, graduate student salaries, et cetera.

02:30:51.378 --> 02:30:52.659
But some percentage of,

02:30:53.601 --> 02:31:03.867
That $1 million, and I think at Stanford it's roughly 50x percent, so let's say another $500,000, would be given to the university for so-called indirect costs.

02:31:03.887 --> 02:31:05.728
This is not something that just happens at Stanford.

02:31:06.248 --> 02:31:09.110
This is typical of every single NIH grant that I'm aware of.

02:31:10.050 --> 02:31:25.838
And the indirect costs pay in principle for administrative handling of the grant and the various infrastructure things related to the mouse care, keeping the lights on, having a janitor empty the trash at night, these sorts of things.

02:31:26.959 --> 02:31:31.241
IDC, as it's called, has become a hot button issue for two reasons.

02:31:31.441 --> 02:31:34.723
One, as soon as the new administration came in, the Trump administration came in, and

02:31:36.891 --> 02:31:44.958
just this last year, they cut the IDC rate across the board, not from, say, 55% at Stanford.

02:31:44.998 --> 02:31:45.959
Other places were 75%.

02:31:46.499 --> 02:31:48.801
Some places were as low as 30%.

02:31:49.142 --> 02:31:51.343
They said, nope, we're not paying this stuff anymore.

02:31:51.724 --> 02:31:58.089
The National Institutes of Health, in other words, the taxpayers, will pay up to but no more than 15, 1.5% above any given grant.

02:32:01.343 --> 02:32:15.212
I'd like your thoughts on that, because this weaves into some bigger issues that relate to a lot of the sentiment that, you know, why should taxpayers be paying for these universities to run, especially when universities, some, not all, have large endowments.

02:32:15.913 --> 02:32:16.093
Right.

02:32:16.133 --> 02:32:24.398
So actually, I should preface my remarks by saying that there was litigation against that 15 percent, which essentially said the government couldn't

02:32:25.433 --> 02:32:26.154
impose that 15%.

02:32:26.574 --> 02:32:27.354
So it's been blocked?

02:32:27.474 --> 02:32:27.775
Yes.

02:32:28.535 --> 02:32:31.557
So right now the rates are whatever they were.

02:32:31.597 --> 02:32:34.359
They're not the 15% based on that court order.

02:32:35.880 --> 02:32:41.463
I can't comment on the litigation and I can't comment as a result of I'm now a member of the government.

02:32:41.523 --> 02:32:42.804
It's like I'm not allowed to do that.

02:32:42.884 --> 02:32:46.866
But I do want to talk about the broader issues related to indirect costs.

02:32:47.707 --> 02:32:49.608
And I want to put it in a broader context.

02:32:49.628 --> 02:32:51.029
So the context is this.

02:32:52.970 --> 02:33:10.620
mid-40s, Vannevar Bush, who was like one of the main science administrators in the United States, he made an argument that the federal government should partner with universities in organizing the scientific infrastructure of the United States.

02:33:11.280 --> 02:33:22.713
The universities were tremendously important parts of the scientific infrastructure, and the federal government had an appropriate role in supporting the universities of the country to do scientific research of interest to the American people.

02:33:23.654 --> 02:33:28.119
So the indirect costs kind of structure came out of that commitment.

02:33:29.480 --> 02:33:31.642
And, frankly, it makes sense to me, right?

02:33:31.963 --> 02:33:42.033
It's appropriate that the federal government have some role in deciding how to support the universities of the country to be organized around research that is in the American interest.

02:33:44.150 --> 02:33:47.231
The question is how much should it be?

02:33:47.351 --> 02:33:48.371
How should it be structured?

02:33:49.091 --> 02:33:51.072
You know, in what way?

02:33:51.232 --> 02:33:54.433
Those are the key policy issues that we're really talking about.

02:33:54.453 --> 02:33:57.093
I think the mention of Venomar Bush is exactly that.

02:33:57.393 --> 02:33:58.954
That's a seed.

02:33:59.014 --> 02:33:59.574
That's funny.

02:33:59.754 --> 02:34:05.396
We're not talking about should there be some federal support for universities.

02:34:05.416 --> 02:34:06.576
The question is how.

02:34:07.416 --> 02:34:14.999
Let me just step back and talk about the current structure, the way it works, because it's really non-intuitive.

02:34:16.399 --> 02:34:19.400
So first, you're a brilliant scientist.

02:34:19.480 --> 02:34:21.681
You apply to the NIA.

02:34:21.861 --> 02:34:24.802
I'm going to go past this part, because we don't need to hear this.

02:34:24.862 --> 02:34:25.702
This is scripted.

02:34:25.942 --> 02:34:29.243
This was very scripted, and so we don't need to hear a scripted response.

02:34:29.263 --> 02:34:30.224
I want to get to the next part.

02:34:32.006 --> 02:34:36.008
$1,000.

02:34:32.086 --> 02:34:36.008
Now, you know, all the projects, not just one, right?

02:34:36.048 --> 02:34:39.270
So it's funding that comics of this work, right?

02:34:39.810 --> 02:34:47.355
My concentrate the federal support for the money in the two to a select few universities.

02:34:48.055 --> 02:34:49.376
They're winners and losers.

02:34:50.296 --> 02:34:56.618
And so the is that are not way in a way need in order to have the right structure with the universe.

02:34:56.638 --> 02:34:57.319
There are right.

02:34:57.459 --> 02:35:04.482
Can we can the can the American taxpayer be sure that we're auditing the use of the indirect costs and the unbelievable facilities questions?

02:35:05.082 --> 02:35:12.365
And then on the on the back of that, there's also other research institutions that have very different, different something on the building.

02:35:12.765 --> 02:35:17.787
Tenured at Stanford, but my lab started off at University of California, San Diego, a public university, typically

02:35:18.147 --> 02:35:34.899
when foundation money comes in, the university imposes a minimum of about 8% administrative cost just for handling that research and for the exploration of whether or not the findings from that basic research will benefit through the private company.

02:35:36.000 --> 02:35:36.420
It's $34.

02:35:36.580 --> 02:35:39.483
Listen, I've been grateful to publish in Nature and Science.

02:35:39.683 --> 02:35:42.184
These are like Super Bowl rings for scientists.

02:35:42.224 --> 02:35:44.186
I'm sure it's part of the reason I got tenure at Stanford.

02:35:45.748 --> 02:35:48.391
and I had great fun doing the work and I believe in the work.

02:35:48.752 --> 02:35:49.873
It stood the test of time.

02:35:50.755 --> 02:35:52.257
I believe in the work.

02:35:55.854 --> 02:36:09.319
Were I not an employee of Stanford that pays for the subscriptions to those journals, I have to buy the work to understand the crazy picture for anyone that doesn't understand how one piece relates to the next, relates to the next.

02:36:09.379 --> 02:36:16.021
And now that I'm in public, I'm in media, I'm public facing, what I've come to learn is that the general public... I'm in media.

02:36:16.801 --> 02:36:17.322
He says it.

02:36:17.342 --> 02:36:18.162
He's in media.

02:36:18.243 --> 02:36:19.143
He's very smart.

02:36:19.324 --> 02:36:20.345
Max Delbruck was right.

02:36:20.945 --> 02:36:26.090
You know, assume infinite intelligence and zero knowledge, but Max Delbruck was right.

02:36:26.591 --> 02:36:27.232
Wow.

02:36:27.352 --> 02:36:32.497
What a name drop that is because Max Delbruck would say that most of this is bullshit.

02:36:33.117 --> 02:36:34.058
Whoa.

02:36:34.339 --> 02:36:37.242
It's very hard for people to connect more than two or three dots.

02:36:37.782 --> 02:36:38.283
They're busy.

02:36:38.904 --> 02:36:44.451
So, we could talk all day about how this leads to that, leads to this, the brick on the wall model, and then there's this treatment.

02:36:45.151 --> 02:36:53.262
And they're like, I'm paying for this stuff and I can't even read the paper about it, let alone glean the positive benefits without paying out the nose.

02:36:53.582 --> 02:36:54.482
I am shocked.

02:36:54.562 --> 02:36:55.443
So a couple of things.

02:36:55.503 --> 02:36:57.884
Let me go backwards, because you had two major issues you brought up.

02:36:57.904 --> 02:36:59.304
So first, the journal thing.

02:37:01.545 --> 02:37:21.674
My predecessor, Monica Bernoulli, who was the NIH director, the National Institute of Health director before me, she made a decision, a really great decision, essentially to say, if the NIH supports a scientist's work, and then that work leads to a journal publication, that publication ought to be available free to the public

02:37:22.503 --> 02:37:23.844
immediately upon publication.

02:37:24.544 --> 02:37:26.105
You're not last year for free.

02:37:26.125 --> 02:37:27.686
So he has to purchase a million.

02:37:28.006 --> 02:37:28.526
That's correct.

02:37:28.787 --> 02:37:30.127
Thousands of dollars to publish it.

02:37:30.187 --> 02:37:30.888
Then they sell it.

02:37:31.148 --> 02:37:33.769
So December of this was I said, why wait till December?

02:37:33.809 --> 02:37:34.810
Let's just do it in July.

02:37:34.930 --> 02:37:35.250
Great.

02:37:35.430 --> 02:37:35.891
Thank you.

02:37:35.991 --> 02:37:38.992
And so starting in July, that what you just said will no longer be the case.

02:37:39.012 --> 02:37:41.814
The American political like journal editors make now is it like the

02:37:42.423 --> 02:37:47.004
the level of investments the scientists are able to make.

02:37:48.184 --> 02:37:53.766
A token to the public for all their, you know, dollars over the last, how old is the NIH?

02:37:53.786 --> 02:37:55.086
170 years.

02:37:55.566 --> 02:38:06.909
I think when people start to understand how the NIH works a bit and they understand this IDC thing, this indirect cost thing, the question comes to mind, you know, how much

02:38:07.919 --> 02:38:11.640
of the cost of running science at a university.

02:38:16.081 --> 02:38:27.943
Then now we've created a place, things that translate to an important device or drug that the university is going to capture some of that upside.

02:38:28.583 --> 02:38:30.444
And Stanford is a place where there's

02:38:31.744 --> 02:38:39.670
let's just say a history of people going into biotech and to neurotech and because of the influence of the engineering school.

02:38:39.691 --> 02:38:49.918
There's actually a great joke about Stanford that a former president of Stanford told me, which is there's only two kinds of Stanford faculty, Stanford faculty with companies and Stanford faculty with successful companies.

02:38:50.999 --> 02:38:53.521
Discussion for another time, but- It's not very funny.

02:38:53.541 --> 02:38:56.763
That I review charting the cell types in the retina.

02:38:56.884 --> 02:38:57.264
I think,

02:38:59.230 --> 02:39:04.732
Most of the time, the university and the scientists who do that work are not capturing the upside.

02:39:05.113 --> 02:39:07.053
The general public isn't capturing the upside.

02:39:07.073 --> 02:39:08.514
They're actually paying for the upside.

02:39:08.534 --> 02:39:09.014
Well, I got to go.

02:39:09.114 --> 02:39:10.375
I can't take it.

02:39:10.435 --> 02:39:12.316
It's so awful.

02:39:12.956 --> 02:39:18.718
I wanted to put aside the business about the US versus the rest of the world.

02:39:19.379 --> 02:39:20.539
Now I want to bring that to the forefront.

02:39:20.999 --> 02:39:24.101
It is also true that American taxpayers

02:39:24.781 --> 02:39:34.064
And Americans pay somewhere between two to ten times more for the same product, the same drug product, as people in Europe pay.

02:39:34.905 --> 02:39:36.565
Why is that?

02:39:37.686 --> 02:39:41.187
There's, again, a lot of complicated reasons around to do that.

02:39:41.747 --> 02:39:43.108
But he's an economist.

02:39:43.208 --> 02:39:46.009
Isn't that what he should be specializing in teaching you?

02:39:46.980 --> 02:39:48.362
is a very, very simple observation.

02:39:48.382 --> 02:39:50.745
There's something in economics called the law of one price.

02:39:51.505 --> 02:39:57.533
When you have one country charging 10, there's a market in one country where the price is 10 times more than for another country.

02:39:57.953 --> 02:40:03.480
What you'd expect is somebody to go buy the goods from the other country, from the cheap country.

02:40:04.960 --> 02:40:12.703
let's pay the cheap price, then go resell it in the- But you can't do that because the FDA's in the way.

02:40:12.763 --> 02:40:13.584
Is that the answer?

02:40:14.044 --> 02:40:15.284
Country that has the high price.

02:40:16.425 --> 02:40:20.466
And now what would end up happening is that you'd get an equalization of the price.

02:40:22.047 --> 02:40:30.711
As long as there's the capacity to move across and essentially close this arbitrage opportunity through competition,

02:40:31.741 --> 02:40:33.461
you'd see those price differences collapse.

02:40:33.961 --> 02:40:43.143
And yet, for decades, Americans pay two to 10 times more for the same product, often made in the same manufacturing facility, than Europeans do.

02:40:44.624 --> 02:40:56.566
And it's, again, a complicated reasons why, but it has to do partly with the way that American health insurers interact with drug companies.

02:40:58.186 --> 02:41:03.369
Drug companies essentially use Americans as a way to fund their research and development efforts.

02:41:03.909 --> 02:41:04.569
That's what they say.

02:41:04.589 --> 02:41:10.972
The higher prices that we pay fund the last mile research that the drug companies do to test the new products.

02:41:11.132 --> 02:41:15.915
Are you saying the last mile research is the most expensive because it's the stage four clinical?

02:41:16.135 --> 02:41:17.095
Guys, this is awful.

02:41:17.255 --> 02:41:18.256
It is so bad.

02:41:21.437 --> 02:41:23.579
They sell the drugs to us at a premium.

02:41:23.620 --> 02:41:27.864
I mean, I have foundations that do research and development down in the United States.

02:41:28.004 --> 02:41:31.048
I heard this recently as a press release from President Trump.

02:41:31.636 --> 02:41:34.777
that drug prices in the United States are sinking.

02:41:35.158 --> 02:41:36.038
Drug has been approved.

02:41:36.578 --> 02:41:37.899
That could be a slightly higher probability.

02:41:37.939 --> 02:41:41.301
That used to link it to the tariff policies.

02:41:41.361 --> 02:41:44.902
These other countries will simply say, no, we're not going to.

02:41:45.142 --> 02:41:49.264
In loose terms, they have much lower abuse potential than a lot of us.

02:41:49.364 --> 02:41:55.587
Truly struggle with by suppressing the wakefulness mechanism as opposed to promoting the sleepiness mechanism.

02:41:55.607 --> 02:41:56.788
We're almost an hour in.

02:41:56.808 --> 02:41:57.148
200% will happen.

02:42:01.858 --> 02:42:06.501
how the drug companies respond to the executive order to make sure of the Americans.

02:42:07.142 --> 02:42:10.404
So all drug profits are had in the United States.

02:42:10.644 --> 02:42:25.654
So we are at an hour now and he has not talked about the opioid crisis at all, even though we opened the whole podcast with the life expectancy in America being at a standstill up until 2019 and then plummeting after 2019.

02:42:25.734 --> 02:42:31.298
We're talking about indirect costs and funding of research and other bullshit.

02:42:31.958 --> 02:42:35.159
It's remarkable, way more remarkable than I thought.

02:42:35.459 --> 02:42:39.561
And are most of those for the sort of Adderall and psychotropic type stuff?

02:42:39.581 --> 02:42:41.501
Sorry, I don't know if psychotropic is the correct term.

02:42:41.581 --> 02:42:44.922
I'm going to get beaten up by people if I don't get this right.

02:42:45.202 --> 02:42:46.643
Let's just say psychoactive.

02:42:49.966 --> 02:42:51.547
to where they're making the most money.

02:42:52.807 --> 02:43:10.954
Just the things that America, Sweden, which is great, that's a good thing, but it's not actually as far as the broad health of the American public addresses illnesses and try to hold on, especially chronic diseases, and as a result, and we're failing at it, right?

02:43:11.094 --> 02:43:14.275
Europe, on the other hand, is seeing expanded life expectancy.

02:43:15.576 --> 02:43:26.067
This, I think, this change of trying to equalize drug prices, aligning our portfolio of NIH investments to meet the health needs of the American people, it's a long-needed corrective.

02:43:26.888 --> 02:43:27.869
You asked me, will it succeed?

02:43:27.909 --> 02:43:28.350
I hope so.

02:43:28.390 --> 02:43:30.272
That's the reason I took this job.

02:43:31.940 --> 02:43:34.263
I'd like to take a quick break and acknowledge our sponsor.

02:43:46.542 --> 02:43:52.805
science and medicine, but also epidemiology and economics.

02:43:52.825 --> 02:44:03.350
There's a saying in laboratories, which is that just adding more money doesn't improve the science, but it certainly allows you to take bigger risks in service to health and discovery.

02:44:04.031 --> 02:44:06.332
And without money, no science gets done.

02:44:06.960 --> 02:44:08.280
I mean, no money, no science.

02:44:08.320 --> 02:44:10.441
You can't pay graduate students, postdocs, et cetera.

02:44:10.861 --> 02:44:15.962
I don't want to spend too much time on the structure of basic laboratories, although that's my leaning.

02:44:15.982 --> 02:44:19.123
I could spend hours talking to you about what's going to happen.

02:44:19.303 --> 02:44:30.646
I would say that one of the things that he's reinforcing there is the idea that scientists eventually have to have postdocs and graduate students, because I think that's bullshit.

02:44:30.906 --> 02:44:35.347
Right up until I left academia, I was doing experiments every day.

02:44:36.067 --> 02:44:40.369
because I was one of the only people who could do them as well as needed to be done.

02:44:40.989 --> 02:44:44.270
And it was very hard to pass that expertise on to somebody else.

02:44:45.891 --> 02:44:53.474
I could supervise somebody for a little while, but inevitably a postdoc isn't interested in mastery of a particular methodology.

02:44:53.494 --> 02:44:55.434
They're interested in exposure to it.

02:44:55.894 --> 02:45:00.036
They're interested in a publication with it, but they're not interested in mastery.

02:45:01.212 --> 02:45:08.914
And if there was anything that frustrated me in my 20 years of being a neuroscientist, it was running into the number of people that wanted the shortcut to the merit badge.

02:45:09.774 --> 02:45:13.215
You know, what do I have to do to get a guitar on my sash?

02:45:13.275 --> 02:45:18.457
Well, you have to learn your scales and, I don't know, be able to play a Pearl Jam song.

02:45:19.457 --> 02:45:20.877
And then you get a merit badge.

02:45:20.997 --> 02:45:22.158
Okay, I'm gonna go do that.

02:45:22.198 --> 02:45:22.858
And then they're done.

02:45:22.898 --> 02:45:27.419
And they go for the rest of their fricking lives calling themselves a guitarist.

02:45:30.185 --> 02:45:31.467
And that's what this guy did.

02:45:31.507 --> 02:45:39.097
He did a few post-docs, he got a couple nature papers, and now he's a visual scientist who supervises other people who do visual science.

02:45:39.157 --> 02:45:47.729
But he's not an expert or a master in anything with his hands, anything with the animals, anything with surgery.

02:45:49.175 --> 02:46:00.071
These are expertises that at this point, he gets postdocs that have them, or he sends graduate students to another place to get them, because that's how real tenure professors work.

02:46:00.531 --> 02:46:04.097
They very rarely have the expertise that they supervise.

02:46:06.997 --> 02:46:07.877
I'll give you an example.

02:46:07.957 --> 02:46:10.238
Lisa Giacomo is at Stanford right now.

02:46:10.818 --> 02:46:16.300
Her grad students are recording from rats and they're alive and they're moving around.

02:46:16.360 --> 02:46:25.203
And if they're doing that, then they're doing something that Lisa Giacomo has expertise in and became an expert in during her postdoctoral work.

02:46:25.723 --> 02:46:35.886
If they're doing MRI, if they're doing, I don't know, transcranial magnetic resonance,

02:46:37.219 --> 02:46:38.860
I have no responsibility.

02:46:38.900 --> 02:46:39.800
That's the problem.

02:46:42.281 --> 02:47:04.831
And so what you have very quickly in academia is a situation like existed with me at the University of Pittsburgh, where somebody like Brian Hooks, captain in the US Navy, wife from China, working for McKenzie, that guy is supervising a dude like me.

02:47:06.636 --> 02:47:11.359
who can't teach me really anything about anything except for maybe MATLAB programming.

02:47:11.619 --> 02:47:13.320
And that he's not even really good at.

02:47:14.040 --> 02:47:20.324
And yet he's supervising me after having gotten a grant using my experimental data.

02:47:22.885 --> 02:47:26.407
That's how these people engage in the fraud that they engage in.

02:47:28.430 --> 02:47:33.274
It's all different layers of fraud where you're really just running a Ponzi scheme.

02:47:33.294 --> 02:47:43.241
You're really just running a little Ponzi scheme and you're not even at the top of it because the Dean is and the Provost is and the head of your department is.

02:47:44.923 --> 02:47:52.669
Shit, the IT guy that gets paid more than you is at the top of that pyramid closer to the top than you are as a tenure track professor.

02:47:54.050 --> 02:47:55.471
That's the reality of this.

02:47:57.441 --> 02:48:06.629
and they're trying to make it all about ideas and health and pharmaceutical profits, and it's just all a malevolent shitshow of liars.

02:48:08.850 --> 02:48:20.400
The universities, et cetera, we'll come back to that, but there is one piece that we opened up earlier that I think it's important that we close the hatch on, which is the notion of indirect costs being now, well- Are we still there?

02:48:20.420 --> 02:48:22.341
Holy shit.

02:48:23.222 --> 02:48:23.883
I can see where

02:48:24.918 --> 02:48:32.242
I'd say, well, why don't they just dip into their saving when it potential for like, if, if you think of it as like a fixed support for the fixed cost of research.

02:48:32.342 --> 02:48:33.183
Wow.

02:48:33.263 --> 02:48:34.303
I can't believe it.

02:48:34.763 --> 02:48:38.926
I agree with my reasons too.

02:48:39.146 --> 02:48:45.609
An hour and 10 minutes of our high paid time of our NIH director was wasted with this jackass.

02:48:46.690 --> 02:48:49.111
And this guy's running ads on that time.

02:48:50.472 --> 02:48:53.554
On our NIH director's time, he's running ads.

02:48:56.778 --> 02:48:58.119
and universities.

02:48:58.539 --> 02:49:03.362
I want to ask one more question, then we'll move into issues of public health, specifically.

02:49:04.222 --> 02:49:08.264
But having been on study section, I realize I never explained what study section is.

02:49:08.284 --> 02:49:14.087
Study section is one of the greater you pay for it as well, new concepts, new hypotheses.

02:49:14.347 --> 02:49:18.270
There's no study section on a given topic, say Alzheimer's, where you

02:49:19.512 --> 02:49:26.101
That's a stupid freaking example because there is a study section on Alzheimer's, you dipshit.

02:49:26.642 --> 02:49:28.965
You didn't have time to come up with a real example?

02:49:30.387 --> 02:49:31.128
Come on.

02:49:32.190 --> 02:49:35.655
Maybe there's no study section on endosomal transmission in the brain.

02:49:36.846 --> 02:49:56.353
you're a neuroscientist you could have come up with something smarter than that you jerk people from the coast but where you also don't see somebody from the midwest somebody from the desert southwest that there's always been geographic coverage in the in the people who decide which grants get funded oh my god that let me even fall certain conservatism

02:49:57.483 --> 02:50:05.807
in a desire to make it originally interesting, but is predictable in terms of its ability to create papers and page grants.

02:50:06.247 --> 02:50:08.668
And then at the end they go, we were funded for 30 years.

02:50:08.708 --> 02:50:14.671
I've had this, when people brag about having the same grant for 30 years, I just go, oh my goodness, you should be embarrassed.

02:50:15.031 --> 02:50:19.033
How about seven different grants over the course of 30 years?

02:50:19.934 --> 02:50:22.175
And tell me that one of them led to something interesting.

02:50:22.984 --> 02:50:38.977
But don't kid yourself into thinking that having a grant, an R01 that lasted 30 years with five renewals, it's like, I look at a lot of those careers of some of my senior colleagues, and I'm like, you made the interesting discovery in the third year of the first iteration of the grant.

02:50:39.197 --> 02:50:42.880
The only thing you've proven is that tenure keeps people around too long.

02:50:43.600 --> 02:50:54.045
But if you write a bunch of grants that don't go anywhere or don't mean anything or are useless because the grant call was useless to begin with, then it makes you kind of a jackass too, right?

02:50:54.885 --> 02:51:04.049
Because at that stage, when he's talking about having seven or eight grants, he's talking about writing seven or eight grant applications to predetermined grant calls.

02:51:06.710 --> 02:51:10.832
You know, glaucoma or anxiety genes.

02:51:12.105 --> 02:51:14.607
or autism spectrum disorder and vision.

02:51:17.069 --> 02:51:19.010
He's a charlatan of the first order.

02:51:19.671 --> 02:51:20.271
It's gross.

02:51:20.972 --> 02:51:30.659
Okay, so before the pandemic in 2020, it was actually for a decade before, I'd been working on measuring the innovativeness of the scientific portfolios.

02:51:32.761 --> 02:51:36.924
Measuring the innovativeness of science portfolios.

02:51:40.939 --> 02:51:42.360
And now he's head of NIH.

02:51:42.761 --> 02:51:49.788
Had a paper that was published on the eve of the pandemic asking how innovative is the NIH portfolio in particular?

02:51:51.109 --> 02:51:54.333
And so, so like, let me just describe the- Oh, that was just by accident.

02:51:54.853 --> 02:51:57.596
The methodology, because it's easy to understand, right?

02:51:57.616 --> 02:51:59.498
So take every single published paper.

02:52:01.286 --> 02:52:03.067
published in biomedicine and I can't do it.

02:52:03.187 --> 02:52:03.808
I can't do it.

02:52:04.108 --> 02:52:07.891
That comes to getting funded.

02:52:07.971 --> 02:52:11.013
It's a little indirect funds to provide to the university.

02:52:11.073 --> 02:52:11.874
Indirect costs.

02:52:11.954 --> 02:52:13.855
Again, I've got a job for life.

02:52:13.935 --> 02:52:14.816
It was money.

02:52:14.856 --> 02:52:16.317
And then you can explore more, et cetera.

02:52:16.437 --> 02:52:24.363
And it's a shell game that every scientist learns to play, because otherwise, as you say, you get it in the neck, which is grant speak for you're done.

02:52:24.683 --> 02:52:25.263
You fire you.

02:52:25.404 --> 02:52:27.165
You have to can't take students or postdocs.

02:52:27.185 --> 02:52:28.386
You got to fire technicians.

02:52:28.406 --> 02:52:30.147
You close your lab and

02:52:30.667 --> 02:52:32.008
You become what's called dead wood.

02:52:32.468 --> 02:52:40.712
So there's a game that's being played and it's it's not a dirty game But it's this kind of like how about like but dead wood is paid really well

02:52:45.785 --> 02:52:48.107
Deadwood is paid very, very well.

02:52:48.487 --> 02:52:49.788
Kind of don't ask, don't tell game.

02:52:50.349 --> 02:52:52.190
Everyone knows that people are doing this.

02:52:52.610 --> 02:52:54.412
And look, scientists are good people.

02:52:54.492 --> 02:52:55.292
I want to be very clear.

02:52:55.312 --> 02:52:56.573
They're just trying to survive.

02:52:57.014 --> 02:53:01.097
Most scientists, I think, I believe most scientists are trying to get it right.

02:53:01.497 --> 02:53:04.740
I think that I think at least half of scientists are liars.

02:53:05.751 --> 02:53:07.692
I think half of scientists are cheaters.

02:53:07.832 --> 02:53:10.013
I think half of scientists know they're lying.

02:53:10.153 --> 02:53:12.934
I think half of scientists know they lie in applications.

02:53:13.454 --> 02:53:14.774
They know they lie in interviews.

02:53:14.834 --> 02:53:16.255
They know they lie in grants.

02:53:16.595 --> 02:53:18.216
They know they lie in abstracts.

02:53:18.296 --> 02:53:19.016
They know they lie.

02:53:21.217 --> 02:53:24.478
They're very good at making up shit.

02:53:25.959 --> 02:53:30.502
And they're very good at twisting shit around to think that, oh, yeah, I guess it is significant.

02:53:30.782 --> 02:53:32.824
Local culture can contaminate things.

02:53:33.084 --> 02:53:36.726
And this grant, this local culture contaminates things.

02:53:37.227 --> 02:53:41.710
What could be worse than the local culture inside of a tenure track laboratory?

02:53:42.570 --> 02:53:47.394
What could be worse than the local culture of a tenure track faculty?

02:53:48.962 --> 02:53:50.883
I can't think of anything worse than that.

02:53:51.463 --> 02:53:52.023
To be funded.

02:53:52.043 --> 02:53:52.864
I'll grant you most of them.

02:53:53.044 --> 02:53:53.564
Okay.

02:53:53.764 --> 02:53:53.984
Yeah.

02:53:54.084 --> 02:53:58.927
And you know, I'm here in part as an advocate for the public and in part as an advocate for the science community.

02:53:58.947 --> 02:54:01.468
I can't split myself any differently.

02:54:01.488 --> 02:54:02.388
So am I Andrew.

02:54:02.488 --> 02:54:02.728
I know.

02:54:02.868 --> 02:54:05.810
But with lower IDC, who will get tenure?

02:54:06.110 --> 02:54:07.110
IDC again.

02:54:08.311 --> 02:54:09.231
for the pandemic.

02:54:10.172 --> 02:54:14.894
It turns out that it's early career scientists that are most likely to be as you tend to wait.

02:54:14.934 --> 02:54:18.115
It's a secret because when you're young, you're hungry, given the space.

02:54:18.576 --> 02:54:20.616
Don't have to beg.

02:54:20.937 --> 02:54:23.158
We need young labs to be funded.

02:54:23.198 --> 02:54:25.399
This is an open door.

02:54:26.119 --> 02:54:28.560
Put them at this postdoc once devoted.

02:54:29.640 --> 02:54:30.301
You know, when I

02:54:31.653 --> 02:54:36.735
did my PhD and did my MD in the early 90s and then into the mid 90s.

02:54:37.195 --> 02:54:45.177
I don't want to destroy this program by saying this, but these are where people finish college and they decide to go two years of research before they decide to go to graduate school.

02:54:45.537 --> 02:54:57.841
This in my mind delays and kind of drains the initiative of a lot of, look, there's nothing more beautiful than someone graduating college who's still excited about biomedical science, taking that energy.

02:54:58.301 --> 02:55:00.382
Usually they don't have a lot of other commitments yet.

02:55:01.002 --> 02:55:03.443
I think we should fund them so they can have a healthy life.

02:55:03.843 --> 02:55:05.944
They don't need to have a lavish lifestyle, but a healthy life.

02:55:06.424 --> 02:55:08.565
A healthy life where they study the genome.

02:55:08.965 --> 02:55:11.786
A healthy life where they contribute to the Human Genome Project.

02:55:18.709 --> 02:55:20.450
I'm still getting new ideas right now.

02:55:20.510 --> 02:55:21.811
It's more about creativity.

02:55:22.291 --> 02:55:25.853
I'm sorry, but science is full of people with no creativity.

02:55:25.933 --> 02:55:30.095
Science is full of gunners like this guy.

02:55:30.535 --> 02:55:33.036
Gunners like Peter Hotez.

02:55:33.136 --> 02:55:35.077
Gunners like ZDogg.

02:55:35.197 --> 02:55:37.438
Gunners like Vinay Prasad.

02:55:40.200 --> 02:55:42.741
You just have to tell them what they have to do and they'll do it.

02:55:44.089 --> 02:55:46.877
I mean, these are not trivial issues that they're trying to pursue.

02:55:47.398 --> 02:55:49.886
They deserve, and their peers deserve,

02:55:50.854 --> 02:55:56.656
the majority of the taxpayer dollars for discovery, because I think that therein lie the number, the net.

02:55:56.716 --> 02:56:00.877
I mean, that's what's discoveries that young, I'm so just, but.

02:56:01.397 --> 02:56:03.158
Just to put a real fine point on it.

02:56:03.198 --> 02:56:13.621
So I think in the 2000 teens, there was a policy that in order to be honest, I think, I mean, it's really hard.

02:56:15.822 --> 02:56:16.803
supports what you're saying.

02:56:17.023 --> 02:56:25.489
There's another aspect, too, which is letting go of one's own ideas, especially if you're funding and your ability to pay your people.

02:56:26.009 --> 02:56:29.912
I was part of the National Eye Institute's audacious goal.

02:56:31.233 --> 02:56:33.775
And sometimes it can lead to good.

02:56:35.476 --> 02:56:36.557
We discourage that.

02:56:37.718 --> 02:56:42.581
Take a big scientific risk where I might fail, but if I

02:56:43.482 --> 02:56:46.563
Academic Biomedicine, we are too intolerant to failure.

02:56:47.543 --> 02:56:48.344
Stardust does not.

02:56:49.644 --> 02:56:50.845
I completely agree.

02:56:51.285 --> 02:56:55.426
And I should definitely point out, I never had trouble getting grants.

02:56:55.666 --> 02:56:57.487
So I'm not coming to this with any cynicism.

02:56:57.587 --> 02:57:02.709
I moved on to podcasting, and I still teach and closed my lab out of a joy of what I'm currently doing.

02:57:02.749 --> 02:57:03.489
It wasn't that I couldn't.

02:57:03.629 --> 02:57:07.030
He closed his lab to podcast.

02:57:07.730 --> 02:57:08.891
Holy shit.

02:57:08.911 --> 02:57:10.171
Stop lying.

02:57:10.551 --> 02:57:10.912
I mean.

02:57:11.112 --> 02:57:11.772
Stop lying.

02:57:12.932 --> 02:57:14.492
This is really bad.

02:57:14.512 --> 02:57:16.873
He closed his lab to podcast.

02:57:17.453 --> 02:57:19.074
That's just an admission right there.

02:57:20.054 --> 02:57:24.195
He's part of this malevolent governance structure on podcasts.

02:57:25.395 --> 02:57:31.597
You know, the thing that Cody was talking about on his news show about how the right wing watches a lot more than the left wing does.

02:57:32.938 --> 02:57:41.500
You know, the Steve Bannon show, the intellectual dark web, it's all one malevolent show and we are trapped in it.

02:57:42.881 --> 02:57:51.266
While the rest of America laughs at us from the outside, we must wake up, we must apologize, and we must pull our heads out.

02:57:58.550 --> 02:58:00.051
risk-taking and unturned the crank.

02:58:00.071 --> 02:58:10.656
The key, probably the most important thing I'm going to be dealing with, that plus the roughness of the NIH portfolio.

02:58:11.257 --> 02:58:19.041
We have to limit their suffering of dire condition due to obesity, diabetes, and on to some remnants of health longer.

02:58:20.101 --> 02:58:22.963
And most of the treatments are geared toward the older population.

02:58:23.043 --> 02:58:23.543
Is that true?

02:58:23.703 --> 02:58:24.284
Yeah, that's true.

02:58:24.704 --> 02:58:29.607
A lot of people, population aging, there was this idea of a compression of morbidity.

02:58:29.727 --> 02:58:37.512
That is, you live a long life, and the time you spent really sick and disabled was compressed at the very end of your life.

02:58:38.272 --> 02:58:58.383
Rather than spending a long time disabled and sick and you you you die die after having spending like a decade or more very sick the idea was that that were which we have advances in our cultures as produced results so that you You live a long life and you only spend you know, a few months really sick at the end of your life That hasn't panned out

02:58:59.405 --> 02:59:08.903
In fact, we have very little increase in life expectancy and for many, many people, unfortunately, a very long period of time.

02:59:10.435 --> 02:59:14.517
in a state where the quality of life is not that high, not that good.

02:59:14.937 --> 02:59:24.221
And so that's the population pyramid problem in a nutshell, and why they had to manage it, and why they needed this Indian saboteur in place to lie about it.

02:59:24.401 --> 02:59:36.626
Dementia, chronic disease leading to, say diabetes, leading to all kinds of kidney failure, macular degeneration, you name it, peripheral vascular disease,

02:59:37.066 --> 02:59:38.286
I can't do it.

02:59:38.566 --> 02:59:48.949
You end up with a situation where all of these amazing biomedical advances that we've had over the last decades have not translated to actually improving the health and well-being and longevity of the American people.

02:59:50.449 --> 03:00:01.412
I think that the biomedical infrastructure, research infrastructure of the country has to translate over for results for real people, for the American people.

03:00:02.952 --> 03:00:06.993
People can ask us, why are we doing what we're doing?

03:00:07.253 --> 03:00:11.134
It can't just be that we're doing cool things.

03:00:11.194 --> 03:00:12.415
I mean, not that we're not doing cool things.

03:00:12.495 --> 03:00:13.575
A lot of cool things are getting done.

03:00:13.615 --> 03:00:19.037
But if they don't somehow eventually translate over, again, I don't mean to distinguish basic science work.

03:00:19.077 --> 03:00:20.397
I think basic science work is really important.

03:00:20.417 --> 03:00:25.378
But eventually, it has to translate over, or else people will think we've made these vast investments.

03:00:25.458 --> 03:00:26.019
These people are lying.

03:00:26.039 --> 03:00:27.159
They are traitors to our children.

03:00:27.919 --> 03:00:42.476
if we're not actually... This is part of the Human Genome Project, and the next stage of it, our sovereignty is being inverted, our children's sovereignty is being inverted under this mythology about vaccines, this mythology about contagion.

03:00:43.470 --> 03:00:46.552
And it is being obfuscated by all of these people.

03:00:46.872 --> 03:00:52.496
The fake health freedom movement will never tell you that intramuscular injection is just plain dumb.

03:00:52.976 --> 03:00:56.738
They will never tell you about the biology of injection versus ingestion.

03:00:57.159 --> 03:00:58.940
They will never tell you about Tony Bark.

03:00:59.844 --> 03:01:02.246
Because the bad biology is what this is all about.

03:01:02.346 --> 03:01:07.630
Evolution because DNA and surrender to your status.

03:01:08.130 --> 03:01:09.911
It's for all the marbles, ladies and gentlemen.

03:01:09.951 --> 03:01:11.252
It's for your grandchildren.

03:01:11.292 --> 03:01:13.234
We're supposed to teach them this bullshit.

03:01:13.994 --> 03:01:15.455
And I would like to not do that.

03:01:15.615 --> 03:01:17.517
I would like to stop that from happening.

03:01:17.977 --> 03:01:24.281
It was a background, ladies and gentlemen, that was misconstrued with nonspecific PCR tests and they got away with it with placebo.

03:01:25.382 --> 03:01:27.764
Stop, stop, stop.

03:01:28.325 --> 03:01:29.506
Ladies and gentlemen, I love you.

03:01:30.046 --> 03:01:31.347
Good to see you on this Monday.

03:01:31.447 --> 03:01:32.588
I'll see you again tomorrow.

03:01:32.648 --> 03:01:33.489
Thanks for being here.

03:01:34.350 --> 03:01:36.311
Thanks for sticking it out.

03:01:36.492 --> 03:01:44.438
If you can and want to find a way to support the stream, please go to GigaOMBiological.com where there are lots of different ways.

03:01:44.758 --> 03:01:48.401
And so that's, you know, it's a complicated question.

03:01:50.445 --> 03:01:50.725
Yes.

03:01:51.806 --> 03:01:53.607
You can capture it, you can sequence it.

03:01:53.647 --> 03:01:54.247
Thank you very much.

03:01:54.407 --> 03:01:55.508
I'll see you tomorrow.

03:01:55.588 --> 03:02:00.370
In condition that we will not call autism.

03:02:00.510 --> 03:02:02.050
I don't like the word autism.

03:02:02.951 --> 03:02:03.871
He was vaccine damaged.

03:02:04.351 --> 03:02:05.772
He was neurologically damaged.

03:02:06.532 --> 03:02:09.213
In condition that we will not call autism.

03:02:09.394 --> 03:02:10.934
I don't like the word autism.

03:02:11.835 --> 03:02:12.695
He was vaccine damaged.