WEBVTT

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um

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the land of the ice and snow from the midnight sun where the hot spring people go

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I come from the land of the ice and snow From the midnight sun where the hot springs flow

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So into the final minute and all are in possession but this is where Mabel is strong, chasing the game.

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Using that intensity we saw it in the semi-final.

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Staring at a slightly torn cloth rabbit for over seven and a half minutes.

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And perhaps a few signs of over-confidence from her rival, a bit of showboating.

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Needs to be careful.

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there's the change from the classic hold still placed on the outside though great technique and a glance at the youngster who shows little emotion but her mind will be empty 20 seconds to go now Olive closing in on victory and that coveted prize of being told she's a very good dog one paw to control and a switch now Mabel sensing this might be a chance still waiting still believing

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And you wonder what Olive is doing here.

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Only has to hold on.

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Going to the upright though.

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High tariff with no opposable thumbs.

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High risk at this stage.

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And it's gone and Mabel takes it.

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No mercy from the younger dog who takes this victory just as time runs out.

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A famous win built on patience and sheer belief.

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For Olive, only thoughts of what might have been, but only herself to blame.

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She's given this one away and that will hurt most of all.

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Bad dog.

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Hey, if you're missing, not on that list, please feel free to send me an email.

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The list comes out as a very garbled Excel file and I have to edit it myself.

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And so if I make a mistake or delete too fast, it could have just jumped off the list.

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And then until I download a new updated version, it will remain that way.

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It's not...

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because I'm not trying to do it it's just not a very easy way and it's not a good excuse but I don't dedicate too much time to that because again I don't think you're donating for me to update that list and I know it's important and I want your name on it so please just send me an email accept my apologies for that.

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While I take that comment definitely to heart, Soothspider, I want to also remind everybody why Soothspider is such an interesting character in the chat and on social media.

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Because he's a guy without hardly any interaction between the two of us, he's promoting the ideas that GigaOM is teaching.

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And that, to me, lends so much credibility to who he is, even though I don't know who he or she is, and who he or she works for, or wants to work for, or who they want to be.

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The same way I don't know for sure who Nick Hudson is, but his behavior with regard to the ideas

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that we're trying to push out is very consistent, as is Mark's, as is Jessica's.

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And so I just want to heads that up to you, you know, that it's not anything to do with my not respecting Soothspider.

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I think it's a great account, a great person who was ever running that place.

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Thank you very much.

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But by maintaining some degree of independence, we also maintain some degree of

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certainty that we are independently coming to see the lies in the same way.

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So I do think though I could use some help.

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So I'll, I'll reach out.

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I promise.

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But you can tell if someone's lying, you know, you can sort of feel it in people.

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And I have lied.

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I'm sure I'll lie again.

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I don't want to lie.

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I don't think I'm a liar.

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I try not to be a liar.

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I hope that wasn't in any way misunderstood to say anything, but thank you very much to Soothspider.

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I hope you heard that correctly.

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...tells us that we're dealing with essentially a worst-case scenario.

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I'm afraid that the latest data tells us that we're dealing with essentially a worst-case scenario.

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I'm not sure exactly who he is.

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His name is JJ Cooey, and I believe he's a consultant for CHD.

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And I believe he has a PhD in some sort of scientific discipline, from what I understand.

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I'm starting to get it into my head that maybe we'll just do the music and then we'll start the show for like most of the shows and then maybe only on Friday we'll do this long introduction.

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I don't know yet.

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I really like the bird.

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I don't want to lose the bird.

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And I also don't want to lose the reference to Fred Rogers.

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So at some point with the Housatonic live commercial and everything else in there, just like, what can I really cut?

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I don't know.

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I guess I just have to

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kind of start earlier or something because hey here we are 11.11 look at that timing hello ladies and gentlemen welcome to the show hit it sliders to my left and mouse to my right and buttons to my left and right and i don't know where to push so it's never going to be perfect i don't think

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But here we are, where only knowledge can dispel the enchantment.

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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Gigaohm Biological, a high-resistance, low-noise information brief brought to you by a biologist.

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We like to be like Galileo Galilei here and just report what we see, report what we read, and try to understand it as a whole.

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We definitely live in interesting times.

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And your consciousness is the prime real estate they're trying to distort with this kind of maneuver where they tell you something about what's true, but they never really work hard enough so that you can understand the truth.

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And that's because this guy and many guys before him have understood that that's not really what's important.

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What's important is what is perceived to be true.

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And that's why, again, this slide is so important for you to understand.

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As long as you're running in the direction they want you to run, we're not going anywhere useful.

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And that's really kind of how we're trying to navigate out of the cave.

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We're trying to find the right questions to ask.

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Like, was there really no spread in New York City?

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Are infectious clones really just transfection and transformation in cell culture?

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Are placebo batches actually not talked about because they don't want us to?

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Is transfection really what we should have called this from the very beginning and therefore it was criminally negligent in humans to begin with?

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I mean, the other questions you might ask are how many different ways were the protocols murdered?

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He might also ask, is gain-of-function real, or is it a mythology that the biosecurity state wants us to believe in?

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He might also ask the question, wait, were we tricked into solving this mystery of a lab leak?

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And were we tricked into solving it by a spectacular commitment of lies that spread across different stages and different social media platforms?

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And oh my goodness,

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The only way that they can fight this truth and these good questions is to attribute bad ideas and bad motives, rather, to the people that disagree with them.

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That's why you know more about George Floyd than you know about this man.

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Some of you might not even know what this man's name is, but you know what George Floyd is.

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And that's how distorted American media and the world media has become.

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This should be one of the most famous American thinkers around the world.

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Maybe he is.

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But in America, he's not.

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And that should tell you a lot.

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Ladies and gentlemen, it should tell you a lot.

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They're also not really being honest about how money is created at this stage.

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They want you to think it's still fractional reserve banking, but that would be a

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That would be a mistake.

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It's not fractional reserve banking anymore when you have fiat currencies trading for fiat currencies trading for fiat currencies for derivatives and no one's ever going to be shown that so you don't have to worry about seeing that but we can show them the biology and lots of people have shown we'll see it as long as we get them to stop listening to these people.

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As long as we stop, you know, imagining that all of this stuff is so out of our control that we might as well just sink back into the couch and watch Netflix, because Ray Kurzweiler says that there's not going to be any disease in 10 years anyway, so all I gotta do is kill time until then.

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And they've been telling these stories for decades.

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Surprisingly, with surprisingly few details different, they've been telling these stories for decades.

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I guess they used to call them latent viruses before they called them novel viruses.

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But it's all the same story.

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It's all the same charlatanism.

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It's all the same snake oil because we inherited these charlatans from our parents.

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And these people inherited their positions from their mentors.

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And if you trace these people back to their mentors, it all seems to funnel back to Kaprowski, and Baltimore, and Gallo, and Plotkin, and a few other people.

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A few other people with the insight to understand that we have to put all this biology outside of us, otherwise people will understand it as a part of us.

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That's why David Baltimore's scheme of molecular biology is almost exclusively outside of the mammalian system, outside of the human system.

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It's all virology.

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If you want to escape this mythology, we're gonna need to make gentle the life of this world as we do it.

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I show this man because I think they might even be using this man's son against us.

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That's not a fun thing to say, man.

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I don't like it.

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I don't enjoy saying that because I, for a long time, used to work for the guy, and I believed in him, and I still want to believe in him, but unfortunately, his pattern of behavior and rhetoric

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means that he's most likely part of this manufactured wave of opinion, manufactured wave of habits, manufactured wave of questions that everybody agrees are worth asking, and it's actually not true at all.

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If you go with this wave, you're going to be slammed into the coral reef that is the next manufactured crisis that they want you to be slammed into.

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And if our families are going to escape, we need to have a surfboard of truth

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And we need to have teachers that can show people how to surf.

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And so I humbly submit that I'm one of the people that's been trying to teach those lessons for the longest in the pandemic.

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That doesn't mean that I've been doing it right.

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But the principle of staying focused on the biology has gotten us as far as we've gotten.

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The principle of trying to learn how to not take the bait on the social media has also gotten us as far as we've gotten and loving our neighbor

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is actually the thing that has preserved my sanity during this whole thing.

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And so the way this works is that people are consistent in spreading the word by sharing it.

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Again, shout out to Soothspider and all those people like Jeff from Earth that do it on other platforms and cut clips and put them on Instagram.

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I mean, all things.

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I can't even get a substack going consistently, if that tells you anything.

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Of course, some people would say that's because I have such a heavy crack habit.

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You know, because we wouldn't want to get patriots confused with the son of a sitting president or anything like that.

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We wouldn't want to, you know, just make random accusations about people that we generally disagree with, as Cancelled Mouse from France said yesterday.

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I'm still a little bit reeling from the idea that there are people like that out there.

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wittingly or unwittingly, willingly or unwillingly, are participating in this chaotic cluster mess of actively participating in their illusion.

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And maybe that guy was innocently, unwittingly participating, but there's no doubt in my mind he was participating in the sustaining of this illusion because he didn't demonstrate

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the understanding to engage in noncompliance.

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Essentially attacking Pfizer is just exactly what everybody from Jeffrey Sachs to probably Charles Rixey agrees on.

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I mean, this is gigolo and biological.

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So,

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Hello, ladies and gentlemen, it is 1120 in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

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It is the 7th of June 2024.

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Welcome to the show.

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This is a giga ohm biological high resistance low noise information brief brought to you by biologist.

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My name is Jonathan Cooey.

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And it's a blustery day outside, you're going to hear the wind blowing as long as I leave this open.

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And that shouldn't be a problem.

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You probably don't even hear that noise.

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It's only in my ears.

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I'm a human just like you.

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I've got kids who just recently exited school.

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I rent my house, and we're all just trying to figure out how to move forward through this.

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I was let go by CHD.

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I helped Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

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write a book before that.

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And I lost my job at the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine as a research faculty member.

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in 2021 is when my contract ended, but I was told to go home and not come back in October of 2020.

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And so here I am four and a half years later trying to maintain some level of consistency in the sense of remaining humble about my understanding of this

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pandemic phenomenon that everybody is convinced has happened.

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And in the course of trying to struggle to work out some of the incongruities and inconsistencies in the narratives that all of these people have been pushing, I have essentially become one of the

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sort of universally agreed upon, everybody doesn't like him.

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And it's interesting because I'm kind of making the conclusion or rather the accusation that almost everybody shouldn't like me because almost everybody is in on it.

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I'm gonna give a pretty succinct presentation about this several times over the summer, but the first and most, I think, grand slam type, you know, naming names and dates and showing the receipts

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might be at the Red Pill Expo in South Dakota or on my stream the days before it.

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And that's coming up very soon, actually.

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It's June 7th.

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And so really we're looking at about 10 days.

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And so I've been preparing for a while for this.

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In fact, I've been preparing for this essentially my whole life because what is needed is a fundamental reorganization about what questions are important, what questions have been answered and what questions haven't.

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I think this is going to be the first attempt for anybody to try and do this in a manner that, you know, acknowledges that there were good ideas out there all the time and how these good ideas were sort of curated and separated from one another so that they would never summate into a meaningful, informed,

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non-compliance movement.

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And so I really think we're going to get there.

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I really think that we're at a crucial breaking point right now.

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And it's just a matter of keeping on track and not allowing people to distract us from these fundamental biological principles, these ideas that these are the only ideas that need challenging.

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And yesterday, of course, we were distracted into arguing about whether or not I had attacked someone as anti-American or whether Nick Hudson was right about Pfizer.

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And so these are multi-layered hamster wheels that absolutely and totally avoid the discussion of what I consider to be the fundamental ideas that everyone on earth that wants to be free

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needs to come to understand in order to extricate themselves from this mythology.

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The first one, his intramuscular injection of any combination of substances with the intent of augmenting your immune system is dumb, and it always has been.

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Ever since Hilary Koprowski and Stanley Plotkin and David Baltimore and, um,

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And who's the last one?

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Hilary Koprowski, David Baltimore, Stanley Plotkin, and Robert Gallo have sort of created this mythology of retroviruses and DNA viruses and RNA viruses that is exclusively outside of us and has no homologue inside of our own systems.

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They have done that in order to make this

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fundamental truth about our irreducible complexity, very difficult for anyone to see.

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Now a subset of this is that actually transfection, which was what the mRNA shot was, hand transformation, which is what the adenovirus shots were,

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we're always gonna be criminally negligent in healthy humans.

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And that should have been known by all the academic biologists that have ever used these two methodologies on their own investigational benches.

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And that means that I'm essentially accusing every biological faculty member, every medical school faculty member in the United States that's done bench experiments in mice or in other animals that has used transfection and transformation in any form

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to essentially be also willfully negligent here at some point by not speaking up about this simple fact.

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Methodologies that already had names and already were understood to be very limited in their application were applied to populations in mass.

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Even if they use placebos in some places in order to make the total effect difficult or more difficult to detect,

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They still did it.

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And every single one of these faculty members needs to be accounted for.

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You could send emails to these people.

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Just go down the list of any medical school that's in your region and just send messages to them and say, did you know that they called these investigational vaccines were actually transfections and transformations all along?

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That's just a very simple question you could ask people.

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RNA cannot pandemic is something that if an academic biologist hears it,

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There should be wheels that turn and then the only explanation for them not continuing to turn is for them to stick their finger in the wheel and just stop the wheel from turning.

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That's the only way to explain it because RNA cannot pandemic is an idea that should turn wheels for hours inside of someone who hasn't seen through this but has the requisite background to understand what this means in the context of DNA translation and in terms of RNA translation into protein.

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And so this is really significant that when someone who gets the chance and gets my attention on the internet decides that what it's about is calling me out about my particular loyalties to Nick Hudson, even after I explained that, no, it was, you know, that whole video, although I don't handle myself in a good way,

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is a perfect example of what they want.

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They want you to get angry.

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They want you to get all riled up and then actually he wanted me to argue about Pfizer.

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He wanted me to talk about Sasha Latapova.

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He wanted me to talk about whether or not Nick was a good guy and whether or not Nick was lying about Pfizer in that particular video that I attacked him in.

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And if we had engaged in an hour or two long, a two hour conversation about how Sasha Latipova was good or bad, I would have opened up a door, number one, to Sasha Latipova saying, oh no, that's wrong, I didn't do that, whatever that anonymous guy from France said.

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Oh look, see, now Jay's turning on Nick too.

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And so it becomes this thing where they just want you to run in a hamster wheel.

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That's what Twitter is all about.

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The only way to work on Twitter is to find a good idea and promote it.

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or bring a good idea to Twitter and tweet it.

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That's it.

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Reading and discussing things on there will inevitably get you into an interaction with someone who's number one anonymous and therefore could, by all likelihood, be somebody that's not working in our best interest.

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Not to say that we don't need to get rid of anonymity.

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But you need to treat the behavior of anonymous accounts very differently than you treat the behavior of non-anonymous accounts.

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And then even with a non-anonymous account, like Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'

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's account, you need to treat it as something different because you understand it as something different.

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And so each one of these interactions is designed to break you away from these ideas, break you away from saying it in a different way, you know, like weaponized piles of money murdered people and convince people to agree about it being a lab leak.

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Like saying it differently, like the old vaccine schedule is injuring and killing thousands every year.

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Or saying it differently, how about this one?

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We do not need to fear wild RNA molecules.

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I was also going to say free-range RNA molecules because it's even funnier.

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And that's really what we've been led to believe, right?

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And all of these people agree on.

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Robert Malone says that a free-range RNA molecule let loose from the garage of a mischievous biologist could be the next pandemic.

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Jessica Rose has never questioned the idea that free-range RNA molecules can go around the world for five years.

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Neither has the illustrious Geert van den Bosch.

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They all agree that free-range RNA molecules are one of the greatest dangers to face our children and our children's children.

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It's extraordinary, really.

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Stop lying!

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Cage-free RNA.

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And that's what this is.

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There was a free-range RNA molecule that killed millions, that millions more were saved from.

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This molecule probably came from a laboratory and therefore another free-range RNA molecule will come again.

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Stop lying!

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And so it's the spread of bad ideas is more dangerous than the spread of any RNA molecule.

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It's really the case.

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That's what has happened.

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That's what you should see fifth generation warfare as.

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And that's why when Robert Malone says, you'll never figure it out, it's because if you trust him, you won't.

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If you trust Jessica Rose, if you trust Meryl Nass, all the people that he's put on stage, like Sasha Latapova, any of these people, Corey, you will not escape.

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Of course you won't.

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Is it so hard to imagine that social media is just programmed to raise the people up that the national security state wants you to see?

28:21.290 --> 28:27.176
Is it so hard to imagine that the only questions that get amplified are those questions that the national security state wants you to see?

28:27.636 --> 28:31.160
Or is it just that they censor people and don't let people talk about stuff?

28:32.521 --> 28:33.863
Stop lying!

28:37.253 --> 28:39.634
And so that's what these guys are selling, right?

28:39.654 --> 28:44.294
These people are selling the idea that we need to fear free range RNA molecules.

28:44.314 --> 28:45.835
We got a free, we got to fear them.

28:45.975 --> 28:51.356
All of these people say that now, if, if we can get Sukrit Bhakti out of that group, it would be great.

28:51.396 --> 28:54.077
If we can get Peter McCullough out of that group, it would be great.

28:54.137 --> 28:55.317
But chances are, we can't.

28:56.017 --> 28:57.017
Sukrit Bhakti, maybe.

28:57.657 --> 28:58.517
I got to turn that down.

28:58.537 --> 28:59.598
I think the kids were playing.

29:00.758 --> 29:00.998
Dang it.

29:07.332 --> 29:10.614
pesky neighbor kids coming over here and playing Star Wars with me.

29:12.275 --> 29:13.456
They're starting to get good at it.

29:13.496 --> 29:14.916
I think I have to take the stool away.

29:15.697 --> 29:17.238
They're ruining all my high scores.

29:18.979 --> 29:23.121
So yeah, we need to fear free-range RNA molecules.

29:23.141 --> 29:24.082
That's kind of annoying.

29:24.142 --> 29:26.883
And that's what I think these guys are all about.

29:26.923 --> 29:32.406
I think that's why a guy from the Human Genome Project was on all kinds of podcasts

29:33.567 --> 29:40.871
with a dude from the World Bank in Monsanto from April 2020 to May 2020 to December 2020.

29:42.052 --> 29:51.117
And never did he meaningfully challenge any of the biology that the national security state was selling that this could be a worst case scenario, but they might be

29:52.077 --> 29:55.540
misconstruing where the worst-case scenario comes from.

29:55.600 --> 29:57.761
It might come from background viruses.

29:57.801 --> 30:02.444
It doesn't have to be a lab leak, and if it is a lab leak, we're gonna need some pretty good data on it.

30:02.464 --> 30:13.872
But since he's in the PCR space, he can explain to you that these PCR tests are just being used incorrectly, or being exaggerated, or being misreported, or there's a financial incentive.

30:13.932 --> 30:17.995
It couldn't possibly be that they're lying, although I guess it's possible that I don't think they are.

30:19.022 --> 30:21.764
That was the conclusion of the third podcast.

30:21.804 --> 30:22.845
At some point he said that.

30:23.225 --> 30:38.017
And of course this guy has been promoted repeatedly by CHD and all these other big podcasts because he knows that there's, he's discovered, actually how they say it, he discovered that there's double-stranded DNA contamination of the RNA shots.

30:39.329 --> 30:41.310
And so these guys have all been very honest, right?

30:41.330 --> 30:42.651
They've all been very honest with us.

30:43.151 --> 30:50.854
First, they told us that the J&J was causing heart attacks and strokes, and so they pulled it, and whoo, shoot, thank goodness they're not total profiteers.

30:51.174 --> 30:57.337
And now they're being honest again, because although it saved a lot of people, I think it's also hurt a lot of people too.

30:57.397 --> 31:05.141
And so they're not really encroaching on the narrative of Fauci and the fact that this intellectual property, although it was rushed, it saved a lot of people.

31:05.561 --> 31:06.522
which is what he just said.

31:06.542 --> 31:08.003
They're not encroaching on that at all.

31:08.343 --> 31:13.326
It's just a question of, okay, you save some people, but you also hurt a lot of people, right?

31:13.806 --> 31:19.250
And so we're going to have a fake discussion about that.

31:20.130 --> 31:31.798
And no one will ever, ever question again, what the original OG criminal enterprise of the 72 shot childhood vaccine schedule of America did.

31:32.659 --> 31:40.984
They won't ever question it because these people are going to vigorously agree, create an illusion of consensus that that's not the problem.

31:41.024 --> 31:42.646
The problem is the COVID shots.

31:42.686 --> 31:43.946
Don't talk about before.

31:44.587 --> 31:45.207
Before.

31:46.228 --> 31:47.649
Don't talk about before.

31:49.807 --> 31:51.910
That's looking backwards, that's dividing.

31:52.030 --> 31:54.153
I mean, who cares what people were doing in 2020?

31:54.814 --> 31:56.816
Who cares who really lost a job?

31:57.157 --> 32:06.990
Who cares who really was hurt financially or set backwards or even lost a house as opposed to selling one?

32:11.803 --> 32:29.001
And let's surround the people with the ideas that we say are super important with people who can talk for 45 minutes and introduce stupid, complicated ideas or dumb, simple ideas which muddy the water around the guy that you say has great ideas.

32:30.762 --> 32:34.745
And if you watch this podcast with Bobby, that's what I see now when I listen to it.

32:34.805 --> 32:55.458
I see a guy who says so many good things about the person that's gonna speak, and then it's actually flipped upside down because that person that he says is so great and that everybody needs to listen to is only given seven minutes, and then this guy talks for the next 40, then this lady talks,

32:56.038 --> 33:01.402
for another 20, then that lady talks for five minutes and this confused lady up there says five more things.

33:03.644 --> 33:05.866
And so the dude that Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

33:05.906 --> 33:14.773
says everybody in the world needs to hear only got seven minutes and then never really was able to talk again because of that guy up there.

33:16.714 --> 33:23.659
And you're supposed to believe that this is just, you know, the way that breaking free works, that fighting for freedom works.

33:24.744 --> 33:29.026
And in reality, what this is, is this is how good voices are absorbed.

33:30.027 --> 33:35.530
It's the same thing that CHD does to people like Laura Bono and Brian Hooker.

33:36.670 --> 33:48.317
They put them in a position where they feel like they're really making progress, but in reality, they're really, they're really just a little, in a little controlled place where everybody knows exactly how far their message is going to go.

33:48.417 --> 33:51.979
And everybody's, you know, who's going to see it isn't, is already converted.

33:52.059 --> 33:53.339
And so it doesn't matter anymore.

33:53.359 --> 33:54.120
And that's what this is.

33:57.281 --> 34:03.566
That's why when they titled this podcast, they didn't title it Jonathan Cooey and Others.

34:05.487 --> 34:08.109
Go look at it on Spotify.

34:08.149 --> 34:12.972
Go look at it on Spotify because they put Malone's face and Malone's name on it, not mine.

34:13.613 --> 34:16.335
Disappearing Flu with Malone and Others.

34:18.456 --> 34:20.878
How's that for thanks for helping me with my book, Jay?

34:23.626 --> 34:31.788
I mean, I don't know how else to respond to these things other than to keep repeating the truth so you can see it as clearly as possible.

34:31.828 --> 34:38.190
Just go to the podcast and look for it on Spotify and see if you can find a podcast with J.J.

34:38.250 --> 34:40.831
Cooey and Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

34:45.493 --> 34:46.853
What I want is high morbidity.

34:47.335 --> 34:56.105
And so this public facing brochure presentation talks about seeding cases and using the internet to create the illusion of a spreading pathogen.

34:57.247 --> 35:11.750
What it doesn't get into are things that are found in the SPARS document, where internet influencers and trusted sources of information can be placed before the pandemic so that you can control the perception and the argument and get higher compliance.

35:11.971 --> 35:25.874
And concepts like EpiGirl are found in that document, which I'm often now referring to Jessica Rose as EpiGirl, again, because I think these people were put in place so that, for example, they could argue about VAERS,

35:28.223 --> 35:33.508
being evidence that these vaccines are so much worse than the old vaccines.

35:34.468 --> 35:49.922
That's the argument that Jessica Rose was making from the beginning of her rise, besides she got censored with Peter McCullough about a, about a, about a, it was something to do with, with cardiac stuff, right?

35:50.933 --> 36:06.538
So she was publicly censored with Peter McCullough in 2020 about some cardiac thing, some cardiac paper, which of course got that idea out and got those two names together out, made her seem like she was being censored.

36:06.598 --> 36:13.580
She got to do a podcast circuit and then say, look, VAERS shows that these new vaccines are actually worse than the old.

36:13.620 --> 36:15.601
They would not even see this signal until now.

36:19.445 --> 36:33.590
Well, what an interesting thing to say in a group meeting where this woman right here, who's been working her whole life to end the vaccine schedule, this man right here who has an adult autistic child to take care of,

36:34.710 --> 36:42.034
and has been trying to work diligently to end the vaccine schedule and to save future children his whole life.

36:42.834 --> 36:50.638
He's the guy who drove across the United States to take the data from the whistleblower at the CDC.

36:53.659 --> 36:57.001
And so what an interesting person to put in front of them.

36:58.760 --> 37:04.223
at every one of these international COVID summits for the last four years.

37:04.263 --> 37:10.506
Why wasn't Brian Hooker or this Nancy lady, I think her name is, from NVIC, why wasn't she touring around?

37:12.407 --> 37:19.331
Why is it that I just found out that after years and years of supporting her and organization, now Mercola has just stopped?

37:21.812 --> 37:27.155
So Mercola was giving her like $300,000 a year from his charity and then suddenly he decided to stop.

37:30.051 --> 37:35.014
All kinds of interesting things going on here, but I think what you see is what I see.

37:36.194 --> 37:38.035
That not all of these people are bad.

37:38.135 --> 37:42.538
Some of them think they're doing good and can't help but believe all these coordinated liars.

37:47.486 --> 37:49.567
And that's what these signal chats were about.

37:49.607 --> 37:51.529
That's what these telegram groups are about.

37:51.569 --> 37:53.970
That's what all these Bitcoin chat groups are about.

37:54.350 --> 38:14.223
They are about little fake groups of people, even slack groups and, and discord chats are little fake groups of people that you'll never be able to verify who's who and whether they're all just independent actors or whether it's three guys with 50 accounts that are fooling the five or six people that are in that group.

38:15.165 --> 38:19.908
fooling them into thinking that all these people agree, yeah, yeah, cover that, yeah, yeah, write that, yeah, yeah, yeah.

38:22.549 --> 38:27.072
And like I've said over and over again, how many people does it take to sabotage an even tug of war?

38:27.272 --> 38:27.993
One, two?

38:29.974 --> 38:32.215
And this is an even tug of war.

38:32.315 --> 38:42.942
So you're looking at a very, very, very difficult nut to crack if you can't see just through who they promote and who they don't promote or who they cut on,

38:44.502 --> 38:48.266
If you can't see how they do it, oh, I gotta change that name.

38:48.786 --> 38:51.109
This is supposed to be Dowd.

38:53.772 --> 38:55.153
Doink.

38:55.774 --> 38:59.097
If you can't see how they do it, then you will never see it.

38:59.157 --> 39:02.621
And that's what Robert Malone hopes, that you'll never see how they're doing it.

39:03.629 --> 39:06.311
But how they're doing it is through an illusion of consensus.

39:06.492 --> 39:08.333
It's an illusion of consensus.

39:08.774 --> 39:13.618
People agree to argue about stuff, and they are agreeing to argue very vigorously about stuff.

39:14.018 --> 39:24.928
That's why Robert Malone tried to convince people for years of certain people being against him, like George Webb, like Sasha Latupova, like Mary Holland.

39:27.130 --> 39:28.912
Interesting names to mention, right?

39:30.216 --> 39:37.180
And that list was just extraordinary because I'm pretty sure that more than half of them were not his opponents.

39:37.240 --> 39:43.864
But it's possible that he definitely wanted to stop Peter and Ginger Bregan.

39:44.784 --> 39:47.706
That's why the only meaningful suit that he filed was that one.

39:48.726 --> 39:53.909
And if that suit, as it seems to be, was real, then that could have really screwed the Bregans for a few years.

39:53.949 --> 39:58.572
I mean, you can't get sued for $25 million and just sit back and not worry about it.

40:02.389 --> 40:04.196
I don't know, I think I need to get, I'm.

40:05.494 --> 40:08.096
I would like people to reach out to Peter and Ginger.

40:08.136 --> 40:17.804
I'd like to talk to them, because I do think the conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is going on right now better than it's ever gone on before.

40:18.664 --> 40:24.749
And now that we're able to show them how it's being done, the only thing they have left is to attribute bad motives to us.

40:25.270 --> 40:26.430
You're dividing people.

40:27.131 --> 40:32.675
And that's why they don't want to talk about these ideas, and they don't want to take these steps.

40:32.835 --> 40:34.276
Anyone could have said it in this way,

40:35.148 --> 40:36.248
Very few people are.

40:37.129 --> 40:38.630
Anyone could have said it in this way.

40:38.650 --> 40:40.450
No one is.

40:42.731 --> 40:44.692
And so that's where we are, ladies and gentlemen.

40:45.673 --> 40:48.914
That's why these bad ideas like we ran into yesterday occur.

40:49.414 --> 40:50.975
And then these people laugh about it.

40:51.015 --> 40:53.216
Well, we're mostly in agreement, but you know.

40:54.834 --> 41:01.764
And what it is really is that they don't want to talk about the fact that weaponized piles of money have murdered people and gotten people to agree about it being a lab leak.

41:01.844 --> 41:05.770
That's why he wanted us to talk about Nick Hudson and lies about Pfizer.

41:08.288 --> 41:12.250
because the spread of ideas is more dangerous than the spread of any RNA molecule.

41:12.290 --> 41:13.370
Watch carefully, right?

41:13.890 --> 41:16.791
Jessica Hockett, Jonathan Cooey, more noise!

41:17.572 --> 41:18.752
Brett Weinstein's great.

41:18.992 --> 41:20.093
Kate Lindley's great.

41:20.553 --> 41:21.793
Brett Weinstein's great.

41:22.654 --> 41:26.855
Jeffrey Tucker from the Brownstone Institute that supports Brett Weinstein is great.

41:27.455 --> 41:28.516
Oh yeah, by the way,

41:30.686 --> 41:38.450
Shannon Joy is great, and Barack Obama wanted this to happen, and Steve Kirsch is great, and oh yeah, Jordan Shettel is great, yeah, that guy.

41:38.790 --> 41:42.972
And Professor Neil is great because he writes about viruses and says viruses are real.

41:43.452 --> 41:52.577
And can you name a single leader who realized the pandemic was a fraud, spoke out about it, and didn't die mysteriously is a reply to Steve Kirsch.

41:53.017 --> 41:56.539
Is he promoting Nick Hudson or is he alerting Steve Kirsch?

41:57.335 --> 42:00.337
that Nick Hudson doesn't agree with him, that we've got to control Nick Hudson.

42:00.637 --> 42:11.445
Oh, Jeffrey Tucker, there's a reply to you and it says, my concern is that it'll be wrong kind of reckoning instead of seeing that COVID as a novel deadly virus was a scam and that pandemics aren't a material threat.

42:11.945 --> 42:17.609
Most will believe that mad scientists can launch deadly pandemics at a whim and demand protection from the state.

42:18.089 --> 42:19.731
Is there anything wrong with that message?

42:19.951 --> 42:20.791
Absolutely not.

42:20.871 --> 42:24.134
So is he promoting the message or is he alerting Jeffrey Tucker?

42:24.294 --> 42:25.795
I think he's alerting Jeffrey Tucker.

42:27.793 --> 42:33.715
And that's probably why this guy interviewed him, because this guy has been on John Campbell's stream.

42:34.155 --> 42:40.137
The thing about Nick Hudson that's interesting is that he doesn't claim to have the definitive knowledge about this stuff.

42:40.177 --> 42:43.017
He's using common sense, and he's got an open mind.

42:43.057 --> 42:46.839
So if any of these people wanted to take a shot at convincing him of something, they could.

42:47.319 --> 42:51.400
But instead, we seem to have some anonymous mouse character from France

42:52.000 --> 42:58.944
trying to, and others, because that's also Jikki Leaks apparently, wants to convince you that Nick Hudson is bad.

42:58.984 --> 43:02.125
That's why Jikki Leaks is like saying that Panda is bad.

43:02.485 --> 43:06.827
That's why I pointed out before that Panda is bad, like all these places are bad.

43:07.708 --> 43:10.609
If you say CHD is bad, you're saying that they're all bad?

43:10.689 --> 43:10.990
No.

43:11.970 --> 43:19.734
If you say Panda's bad, all that means is that they have bad people there, that they're infiltrated, but that's not precise enough.

43:21.306 --> 43:40.295
everywhere is bad that's my whole argument but again they want you to run around because they're trying to mislead the young they're trying to get the young to ask the wrong questions like can we get Pfizer can we get them because we've got data we've got these whistleblowers can we get Pfizer

43:42.541 --> 43:47.554
Oh my goodness, wouldn't it be great if we spent all kinds of energy getting Pfizer?

43:48.215 --> 43:49.940
We should get Pfizer and Fauci!

43:50.381 --> 43:50.942
Let's get them!

43:59.136 --> 44:00.156
So here we are.

44:00.836 --> 44:03.717
That didn't work because we're running out of little memory there.

44:03.797 --> 44:07.738
So I'll just start from this current slide again and then it'll work, I think.

44:07.758 --> 44:07.938
Yep.

44:08.498 --> 44:16.740
So today we're going to do Zooby Debunked and Defunked by Dr. Dan Wilson, but I'm calling him Mr. Dan Wilson because that's how I call myself, Mr. Cooey.

44:17.180 --> 44:25.222
Because I think, you know, if you're going to be honest with other people on the internet, if you're a doctor, it should at this stage, especially if you're going to talk about the COVID pandemic,

44:25.862 --> 44:32.866
You should say doctor when you're a MD, and otherwise you can just say mister, and you can put PhD after your name, which is really how it should be.

44:35.507 --> 44:36.628
So yeah, that's kind of funny.

44:37.068 --> 44:37.388
I don't know.

44:37.508 --> 44:38.349
I just think it's cute.

44:38.869 --> 44:39.489
So here we go.

44:39.529 --> 44:41.490
Let's slide over to this one.

44:42.611 --> 44:46.433
And there will be advertisements, I assume, because this is my Mac.

44:48.434 --> 44:50.655
And I do expect it to be relatively painful.

44:51.456 --> 44:55.138
So I'm going to put it up to a little bit different speed, and we're definitely not going to watch it all.

44:56.514 --> 44:57.735
unless it's so entertaining.

44:58.856 --> 45:11.287
But the main issue that I would like to do and the main thing that I would like you to, if you want to participate in the chat, one of the things that we could do together in order to keep sane, because it's going to be difficult, right?

45:11.327 --> 45:12.908
I don't think Zuby is a good player.

45:12.968 --> 45:18.433
Zuby has been on Joe Rogan, so it's very difficult to believe that he's a free player.

45:20.234 --> 45:38.285
Zuby and Dan are going to engage in this limited spectrum of debate and what we should do in order to keep our brains clear and sane is to try and... What's the right word?

45:38.885 --> 45:41.267
Try and express the question

45:42.662 --> 45:49.849
that they are discussing, express the question that they have decided is worth asking or worth debating the answers to.

45:50.429 --> 45:59.337
Because that's how we will essentially define the walls of our cage going forward is what question is being asked here and how are they answering it?

45:59.958 --> 46:04.142
Because if they are asking the wrong question and then answering it with

46:05.367 --> 46:17.949
answers that don't reveal the dumbness of the question, then they're doing exactly what I would imagine this, how this, this campaign of lies is being waged upon us.

46:17.989 --> 46:19.810
So welcome to the fire.

46:19.830 --> 46:25.131
Um, it's not going to be fun, but as long as you keep your humor, um, it should be okay.

46:25.591 --> 46:29.691
Uh, let's try 1.5 because I bet you it's okay.

46:30.531 --> 46:32.352
Um, I hope it'll be okay for you guys too.

46:35.410 --> 46:38.994
When it comes to infectious disease, it's not just one person that we're talking about here.

46:39.054 --> 46:41.236
I mean, this has been the history of public health.

46:41.436 --> 46:42.717
What's up, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls around the world?

46:42.737 --> 46:45.039
I would like to welcome you back to The Real Talk with Zuby podcast.

46:45.340 --> 46:47.081
On today's episode, we have got on Dr. Dan Wilson.

46:47.141 --> 46:50.365
He is a molecular biologist and host of the YouTube channel Debunk the Funk.

46:50.485 --> 46:51.265
So welcome to the show, man.

46:51.806 --> 46:52.347
Hey Zuby, what's going on?

46:52.967 --> 46:53.527
Yeah, I'm all good, man.

46:53.608 --> 46:53.908
I'm all good.

46:53.928 --> 46:55.309
I'm glad that we're finally having this conversation.

46:55.329 --> 46:56.449
I know it's, I know it's long overdue.

46:56.730 --> 47:00.252
We've had a lot of, a lot of back and forths over the last couple of years during the whole pandemic era.

47:01.153 --> 47:03.254
So a fake rivalry on a lot of various things.

47:03.274 --> 47:08.137
And we were meant to have this conversation, I think last year, but I've been traveling like crazy and we keep, yeah, it just keeps going back and forth.

47:08.157 --> 47:09.738
So I'm glad that we're, I'm glad that we're finally making it happen.

47:09.758 --> 47:10.399
How's everything on your end?

47:10.759 --> 47:11.139
It's all good.

47:11.199 --> 47:11.840
I'm busy too.

47:11.860 --> 47:12.740
I got my second kid now.

47:13.160 --> 47:14.481
It's four months old and keeping us busy.

47:14.521 --> 47:18.004
But yeah, you know, I mean, we know we don't see eye to eye on the pandemic, but

47:19.025 --> 47:23.730
point of your show is to have conversations, and let's just talk about it and see if we can come to some understanding.

47:24.370 --> 47:24.791
Absolutely, man.

47:24.891 --> 47:25.832
And congrats on the new edition.

47:25.852 --> 47:26.893
It genuinely makes me happy to hear that.

47:26.913 --> 47:27.133
Thanks.

47:27.914 --> 47:28.214
Awesome, man.

47:28.254 --> 47:29.235
Well, I've done a brief intro there, man.

47:29.255 --> 47:33.360
But for those who are not familiar with you and your work, just please give a little bit of an introduction and background.

47:33.860 --> 47:34.160
Yeah, sure.

47:34.200 --> 47:37.283
So my background is I have a PhD in biological sciences.

47:37.543 --> 47:39.024
I got that from Carnegie Mellon University.

47:40.045 --> 47:49.213
From there, I went on into industry because I don't know if you know much about academia, but with my wife and I being about to have our first child, I wasn't going to continue in that.

47:49.733 --> 47:53.236
So I went into industry, we moved, and now

47:53.891 --> 47:54.511
I work at Janssen.

47:54.551 --> 47:55.652
I'm a senior associate scientist there.

47:56.252 --> 48:02.215
And in my spare time, I just do a YouTube channel because personally, I used to believe in a lot of conspiracy theories when I was younger.

48:02.835 --> 48:04.816
And science helped kind of pull me out of that thinking.

48:05.497 --> 48:14.921
And so I thought, what better way to still have fun learning by challenging bad science and also just give myself a hobby to do in that realm.

48:14.941 --> 48:15.582
So I started.

48:15.622 --> 48:16.462
That's hilarious.

48:16.482 --> 48:22.145
So he's trying to make the argument that he decided to do this because it's a hobby.

48:23.135 --> 48:39.683
Um, that's really interesting because unlike him, I actually have a track record of starting a YouTube channel right before the pandemic with actually something to say that had nothing to do with the pandemic and nothing to do with debunking science.

48:41.280 --> 48:49.785
So it's interesting, right, that essentially you have these inorganically appearing people that have decided, hey, I think I'm going to start podcasting.

48:49.805 --> 48:54.607
What was Kevin McCairn doing before the pandemic and before he had a super spreader event?

48:56.288 --> 49:01.771
That he just decided to do three and four hour daily podcasts in March of 2020.

49:03.376 --> 49:04.556
What excuse did he have?

49:04.617 --> 49:15.941
Because I was riding a bike to a medical school where I had a faculty position and I was trying to do journal club on a bicycle about neurobiology, which was my specialty.

49:16.601 --> 49:25.585
It's not like Kevin McCarran or Eddie had a preexisting neurobiology thing where he was talking about Tourette's syndrome or teaching about amyloidosis.

49:27.534 --> 49:34.319
It's not like Paul Cuttrell had a podcast before the pandemic where he was teaching investment tips and then suddenly decided, hey, wait a minute.

49:34.920 --> 49:37.422
Thank goodness I decided to take a course at Harvard.

49:37.882 --> 49:42.406
I can now talk about the pandemic and take whistleblowers from Taiwan about Remdesivir.

49:45.488 --> 49:51.873
And so he's trying to tell you that, yeah, you know, I have kids and if you know anything about academia, you're not going to go into that.

49:53.226 --> 49:55.848
I got a PhD in biological sciences.

49:55.888 --> 50:07.436
Can I remind you of what Peter Thiel told us on the Portal podcast in 2019 about the hyperspecialization that's found in sciences?

50:07.836 --> 50:19.544
He's not going to tell you that what he did was work on one particular subunit of ribosomes and do little point mutations in it to see if he could find the functional relevant

50:21.041 --> 50:25.787
amino acids of this particular subunit or this particular rival protein.

50:26.487 --> 50:38.341
I apologize for not knowing the exact details of his PhD, but if you're going to go that hyper specialized into a particular topic, then you're not getting a PhD in the biological sciences.

50:38.982 --> 50:43.064
It's already a little broad for me to say that I have a PhD in neurobiology.

50:43.144 --> 50:52.610
My PhD was in cellular neurophysiology and biophysics of the single neurons.

50:54.804 --> 50:59.287
I mean, I'm not an equal expert in systems physiology.

50:59.307 --> 51:00.788
I can read those papers.

51:00.848 --> 51:01.989
I've read them for years.

51:02.489 --> 51:11.876
But again, it's the lack of precision, including him presenting himself as Dr. Dan Wilson and being as, let's say,

51:16.079 --> 51:23.045
as imprecise as possible so that the average person will take his expertise to be as broad as possible.

51:23.485 --> 51:39.097
How can we explain a person who never even tried to do a postdoc rising to a senior associate scientist at Janssen after working for a testing company whose name slips my head a few years ago?

51:40.398 --> 51:42.140
Congratulations on the second kid.

51:42.180 --> 51:42.960
That's really great.

51:44.842 --> 51:45.202
Kind of.

51:48.464 --> 51:49.145
Wow, I don't know.

51:49.225 --> 51:52.748
I mean, again, what questions are they going to ask?

51:52.808 --> 51:54.450
What questions are they going to debate about?

51:54.490 --> 51:57.392
And what answers are they going to agree are worth arguing about?

51:58.033 --> 52:05.140
Once you start to see this move forward, it's going to be painful because they are going to mislead millions of young people.

52:06.821 --> 52:07.582
That's the plan.

52:08.583 --> 52:10.445
Keep in mind, I think this is a

52:11.960 --> 52:14.343
He might even be supported by Canadian money.

52:15.484 --> 52:22.593
There was something to do with a Canadian propaganda fund or some kind or another that he may have gotten money from.

52:22.633 --> 52:24.235
It doesn't matter, but I'm sure it's true.

52:25.617 --> 52:26.137
Yeah, that's about it.

52:26.818 --> 52:27.379
Okay, interesting, man.

52:27.399 --> 52:29.962
There's a term that you use there, which I know you use a lot, which is bad science.

52:30.002 --> 52:31.184
So tell us what bad science is.

52:31.929 --> 52:49.371
So when I cover bad science, usually it's either poorly communicated science, so it could be a good paper that is getting misinterpreted or getting spun in a way that does not represent what the findings actually are, or it could be a

52:50.852 --> 52:53.896
bad paper where maybe the authors used poor methods.

52:53.976 --> 52:57.119
They did some, maybe they did some fabrication of data.

52:57.219 --> 53:03.806
Maybe they published it in a predatory journal and the work is just not up to par and they're making bold claims with it that can't be backed up by their actual findings, nor can they be backed up.

53:03.846 --> 53:10.133
And so it's not, he's never, ever, ever, and reminding you, Zuby is not prepared

53:11.092 --> 53:28.722
to push back and say, isn't it more what Girk Gigerenzer says it is, that it's like this ritual of probability that defines whether or not an observation is significant, that has allowed the creation of a lot of noise that has been misrepresented as knowledge.

53:29.283 --> 53:35.747
So instead, Brian Wilson specifically focuses on fraud or bad experiments and not

53:36.767 --> 53:41.690
specifically able to say that, well, most experiments don't test the model they say they're testing.

53:42.730 --> 53:51.154
Most experiments are actually designed to disprove a null hypothesis, which doesn't test the model that they have for the world.

53:51.234 --> 53:56.597
So it's interesting, to the point of nauseating, that this

54:00.051 --> 54:09.035
what can only be described as a unwitting participant, because I actually believe he believes everything that he says because people have told him that he's right.

54:09.995 --> 54:21.039
And because he doesn't have the lifelong experience that a regular adult does, he has no background on which to base his trusting of the people around him.

54:22.360 --> 54:29.703
And so it's just naive people telling other naive people that you're believing the right stuff.

54:32.782 --> 54:38.547
It's like imagining that you would go into a church and follow their ritual and then have them tell you that you're wrong.

54:39.788 --> 54:44.152
And if you go to the church and you follow their ritual, no one's gonna tell you you're wrong.

54:44.212 --> 54:46.034
And that's why he's there now.

54:47.028 --> 55:07.448
because he has gone to academia, he's done it exactly as he said, he followed the way into industry and did exactly what he thought they wanted him to do, said what he wanted to say, said what he thought everyone around him believed, and they probably did, because there is an illusion of consensus that runs through all of these industries and all of academia.

55:09.722 --> 55:26.514
where simple ideas like transformation and transfection are not appropriate investigational vaccine methodologies that are appropriate for rolling out in healthy kids, nevermind healthy grandparents, they're never gonna get to that simple expression.

55:28.032 --> 55:37.641
because the idea is to create a dumb, simple, or stupid, complicated version of these limited spectrums of debate, where in reality, there is an answer.

55:38.181 --> 55:40.704
There is a very succinct way to say these things.

55:41.805 --> 55:52.535
But the goal of both of these guys is to say either side of this limited spectrum of debate in such a vigorous way that you don't see it for what it is.

55:54.205 --> 55:59.751
the scientific community's findings when they actually challenge those data and try to reproduce them, interrogate them, build upon them, whatever.

56:00.151 --> 56:04.055
So from that bad science, you get a lot of misunderstanding of science.

56:04.075 --> 56:07.178
And I think that's generally a big problem around the world.

56:08.059 --> 56:09.000
Science is a difficult field.

56:09.180 --> 56:11.282
Science is generally a difficult topic to understand for a lot of people.

56:11.442 --> 56:15.527
And the mainstream media often gets it wrong in their headlines or in their short segments on the news.

56:16.067 --> 56:17.388
And science

56:18.368 --> 56:21.070
is a difficult field for people to understand.

56:21.810 --> 56:32.237
I guess that's science with a capital S, the same science that Tony Fauci says, I am speechless at this level of rhetoric.

56:32.297 --> 56:37.861
He really deserves a face palm right in his forehead that knocks him down to his ass, because that's how dumb this is.

56:39.362 --> 56:44.206
I mean, again, he's never come against, it doesn't sound like he's ever really been challenged

56:45.287 --> 56:46.227
by a faculty.

56:46.787 --> 56:51.149
It doesn't sound like Carnegie Mellon's biology faculty is as good as I imagined it was.

56:51.269 --> 57:05.492
If this is who they graduate and he says he got a degree in biological sciences and can't explain that he's hyper specialized in the molecular biology of a particular subunit of a particular RNA in a particular model.

57:06.472 --> 57:08.333
Oh boy, oh boy, it's amazing.

57:09.246 --> 57:12.847
either get it wrong or they don't dive into it enough so that people actually understand it.

57:13.287 --> 57:17.029
And so it's on the job of scientists to actually communicate and correct that.

57:17.309 --> 57:21.490
But a lot of scientists aren't trained to do it, don't care to do it, and are too busy to do it.

57:21.850 --> 57:25.072
So some scientists aren't trained to communicate it.

57:26.012 --> 57:27.332
I'm not sure that he was trained.

57:29.473 --> 57:30.373
Some don't know how.

57:31.274 --> 57:33.355
But he does it as a hobby because it's fun.

57:36.058 --> 57:41.906
And I guess he, I don't know, I am just, it's bewildering to me that anyone takes this character seriously.

57:42.587 --> 57:48.716
So yeah, that science can be all of those things that scientists ultimately have the responsibility of correcting.

57:49.795 --> 57:50.075
Understood.

57:50.396 --> 57:56.642
OK, so as I've already said at the beginning of the conversation, we've had a lot of we've had a lot of back and forth and on Twitter, I wouldn't say that.

57:56.682 --> 58:03.049
So it's interesting because actually it feels like Zuby is going to take this as a very Zen thing and just let this guy talk.

58:03.589 --> 58:06.152
And if that's the case, then I have something to learn from him.

58:07.813 --> 58:10.576
I'm already impressed with his ability to

58:11.337 --> 58:12.158
just let him talk.

58:12.919 --> 58:13.860
I've got a lot to learn.

58:13.880 --> 58:14.601
There's no question.

58:15.182 --> 58:16.103
Been the most friendly.

58:16.443 --> 58:24.292
My goal of this podcast is not necessarily to to like fight or debate and I absolutely never you know insult my guests or results ad hominem or anything like that.

58:24.332 --> 58:26.815
You're you're the guest on my show and I treat it as such as my host.

58:27.196 --> 58:30.079
I want to say up front that I am open to learning.

58:30.279 --> 58:31.421
I am open to having my mind

58:31.821 --> 58:32.101
changed.

58:32.241 --> 58:38.286
I think that there are probably things that we are both dug in at this point to the extent that a mind change might be unlikely, but there are going to be thousands of people who listen to this.

58:38.626 --> 58:48.672
So I'm just open to have a conversation and see where it goes, see where it leads, see what our points of disagreement are, see what our points of agreement are, see how we think, how we reach our conclusions, and let the chips fall where they may.

58:49.013 --> 58:55.697
So I guess the first question I'm going to ask you about this is, obviously, you've responded- My first question is, did Franklin Barbecue pay for that t-shirt?

58:55.737 --> 58:58.079
Because remember, remember,

58:59.758 --> 59:04.939
Joe Rogan and this network have a lot of implanted ads and all their stuff.

59:05.320 --> 59:09.741
So if that were Black Rifle Coffee, it would be obvious.

59:09.821 --> 59:14.422
But if it's Franklin Barbecue in Austin, Texas, where's Austin, Texas?

59:15.142 --> 59:17.183
Isn't that where Joe Rogan is?

59:21.274 --> 59:23.737
Did anyone catch that before I decided to mention it?

59:23.777 --> 59:25.460
Because I think that's quite significant.

59:25.800 --> 59:35.173
Like what T-shirt you wear on Zuby's podcast, knowing that Zuby's got millions of followers and people that aren't following him, but watch him a lot, that's pretty significant.

59:36.482 --> 59:38.503
over the, I don't know, the first time we had any interaction online.

59:38.563 --> 59:41.665
It was maybe perhaps late 2020 or sometime in 2021 for sure.

59:42.266 --> 59:46.388
But I've had various tweets that have gone out there, which I know that you have specifically taken issue with.

59:46.428 --> 59:49.330
I think you've taken issue with a lot of my communication during the time around the pandemic.

59:49.450 --> 59:54.513
And we certainly were not seeing eye to eye on the risk of lockdowns and masks and mandates and all of that stuff.

59:54.853 --> 59:57.595
So let's maybe just start with an open question of

59:58.678 --> 01:00:08.159
What's the greatest thing that you have taken issue with in terms of my communication, or what is the biggest thing that you think that I'm getting or have gotten wrong throughout this?

01:00:09.157 --> 01:00:17.604
So I guess my biggest issue with things that you've said is you have put out the sentiment that COVID vaccines, specifically mRNA vaccines, are killing thousands of people.

01:00:18.104 --> 01:00:20.506
And you're giving the impression that they're dangerous and that they shouldn't be taken.

01:00:21.227 --> 01:00:24.649
And that is, I guess, the biggest issue that I have with your communication.

01:00:24.769 --> 01:00:27.872
And I'd be curious to see what... Sorry about that.

01:00:27.972 --> 01:00:29.973
I was pushing up the wrong slider.

01:00:30.033 --> 01:00:32.215
That's why his voice was a little low.

01:00:32.335 --> 01:00:33.636
I am so sorry about that.

01:00:33.676 --> 01:00:34.357
That's my bad.

01:00:34.777 --> 01:00:35.918
I got the right slider now.

01:00:35.978 --> 01:00:36.498
Sorry about that.

01:00:37.339 --> 01:00:55.974
have seen that brings you to that conclusion okay that's interesting all right i mean i think there were many criticisms okay i'm gonna go back and the impression that they're dangerous i guess what's the greatest thing that you have taken issue with in terms of my communication or what is the biggest thing that you think that i'm getting or have gotten wrong throughout this

01:00:57.075 --> 01:01:05.500
So I guess my biggest issue with things that you've said is you have put out the sentiment that COVID vaccines, specifically mRNA vaccines, are killing thousands of people.

01:01:06.000 --> 01:01:08.402
And you're giving the impression that they're dangerous and that they shouldn't be taken.

01:01:09.122 --> 01:01:12.544
And that is, I guess, the biggest issue that I have with your communication.

01:01:12.664 --> 01:01:16.987
And I'd be curious to see what you have seen that brings you to that conclusion.

01:01:18.514 --> 01:01:19.215
That's interesting.

01:01:19.375 --> 01:01:22.216
I think there were many criticisms prior to this in terms of the lockdowns and things like that.

01:01:23.817 --> 01:01:23.937
Sure.

01:01:24.298 --> 01:01:26.979
I'm happy to start with the shots if that's where you want to start.

01:01:28.160 --> 01:01:31.102
By the way, I don't do politician answers.

01:01:31.282 --> 01:01:38.726
But in the course of some of my answers, I might ask you questions so that I know that we're coming from the same place in terms of statistics and numbers and things like that.

01:01:38.766 --> 01:01:41.868
If there's something that needs to be corrected or we're coming from different sources, then it can be clarified.

01:01:42.709 --> 01:01:44.430
I'm going to lay out what my position is.

01:01:44.950 --> 01:01:46.551
I think that you've partly got it right.

01:01:46.651 --> 01:01:47.692
I would say that I know for sure

01:01:48.152 --> 01:02:02.783
i have never told anyone not to take the shot um my position has i have never told anyone not to take the shot what an interesting thing to say because guess what i did

01:02:05.137 --> 01:02:16.123
Although I didn't say it as early as I wanted to in December of 2020, I put out a review in May of 2021 where I said definitively we need to pause all transfections now.

01:02:16.663 --> 01:02:18.284
Did I have all the biology right?

01:02:20.125 --> 01:02:22.526
Did I have even some of the biology right?

01:02:23.787 --> 01:02:24.487
Not really.

01:02:25.888 --> 01:02:27.349
Not the way that I have it now.

01:02:28.289 --> 01:02:32.692
And that's why it's featured on a link on my website called Scooby.

01:02:34.062 --> 01:02:37.987
and why it has a little paragraph there that explains that I was lost.

01:02:38.147 --> 01:02:39.929
I was being misled by people.

01:02:39.989 --> 01:02:45.395
And I did think that the transfection was working, but it was making the spike protein change faster.

01:02:45.455 --> 01:02:47.998
And so then we might enrich it for other things.

01:02:48.038 --> 01:02:53.064
And so we better pause because I don't want to say that it doesn't work, but it could work in a bad way.

01:02:55.270 --> 01:02:57.792
And that was exactly what they wanted me to be saying.

01:02:57.832 --> 01:03:04.258
That was a perfect thing to say, as long as I said it in May, because in June, Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

01:03:04.338 --> 01:03:05.499
wasn't going to come anywhere.

01:03:05.899 --> 01:03:11.584
It was going to be Robert Malone and Brett Weinstein and Steve Kirsch.

01:03:13.826 --> 01:03:13.986
Hell,

01:03:15.916 --> 01:03:25.400
Brett Weinstein wouldn't even bother to interview Bobby Kennedy until November of 2021 and then he wouldn't even release the video until 2023 in February.

01:03:27.241 --> 01:03:35.244
So just after I wrote my review that nobody watched and nobody listened to, some people shared it online but not very many people,

01:03:38.325 --> 01:03:42.307
Then Byron Bridle comes out and says, oh my gosh, look what I got from Japan.

01:03:42.347 --> 01:03:44.728
And then right away he gets silenced.

01:03:44.788 --> 01:03:46.469
And there comes Robert Malone.

01:03:46.589 --> 01:03:47.869
There comes Steve Kirsch.

01:03:48.330 --> 01:03:50.391
There comes Brett Weinstein.

01:03:50.411 --> 01:03:52.411
And what was their message in 2021?

01:03:52.592 --> 01:03:53.752
Well, masks work.

01:03:54.532 --> 01:03:59.575
Forced drugging of everybody could get us to zero COVID easily because ivermectin's that badass.

01:04:00.815 --> 01:04:06.438
And Robert Malone took two shots because he thought it would help with his long COVID and because Peter Cullis told him it was good.

01:04:08.032 --> 01:04:09.293
That's what we're supposed to believe.

01:04:11.194 --> 01:04:13.716
And Zuby didn't tell anybody not to take it.

01:04:14.156 --> 01:04:15.677
I told people to take it.

01:04:15.777 --> 01:04:20.020
Now I'm telling people that transfection is criminally negligent and it always was.

01:04:22.301 --> 01:04:26.424
This happened 24 hours ago, ladies and gentlemen.

01:04:31.292 --> 01:04:48.937
been throughout the thing, even from beginning of 2020, has been opposed to the mandates, opposed to the coercion, and opposed to the lies and just the dishonesty, in my opinion, coming from the media, coming from politicians, coming from so-called public health experts, not just, I mean, in different countries, I'm from the UK, but I think wherever you go, the messaging was largely similar.

01:04:49.577 --> 01:05:01.971
So my personal viewpoint is based off of, firstly, just starting out with how, you know what, actually, I think a good place to start would just be how dangerous slash deadly we both think that COVID itself is, because I think that perhaps we don't see eye to eye on that.

01:05:02.332 --> 01:05:03.873
And as a result, everything that follows

01:05:04.574 --> 01:05:06.534
we are missing each other on.

01:05:06.974 --> 01:05:09.135
So my viewpoint, well, I mean, not my viewpoint.

01:05:09.155 --> 01:05:17.616
I mean, look, actually before this conversation to make sure that I'm not like just sort of running things off of my feelings, I wanted to check the infection fatality rates by different age groups.

01:05:18.137 --> 01:05:29.019
So the numbers that I have seen, I have got a link to this, but based on the numbers that I've seen, for the various age groups, the median infection fatality rates that I've got for age zero to 19 years old is 0.0003.

01:05:31.081 --> 01:05:32.662
Okay, so what are we doing here?

01:05:32.742 --> 01:05:37.904
We're trying to do the thing that we want to do here, which is this one.

01:05:38.004 --> 01:05:38.924
No, not that one.

01:05:39.004 --> 01:05:39.465
This one.

01:05:41.485 --> 01:05:46.828
And what we're going to try to do is look at... Wait, why?

01:05:46.988 --> 01:05:48.388
Oh, that's not the right way to do it.

01:05:48.428 --> 01:05:49.109
I can't do that.

01:05:49.169 --> 01:05:49.589
That's right.

01:05:49.769 --> 01:05:54.931
Okay, I can't pull two screens here because the Mac doesn't pull to the inset.

01:05:54.991 --> 01:05:55.612
Sorry about that.

01:05:57.205 --> 01:05:57.986
Anyway, it doesn't matter.

01:05:58.167 --> 01:06:00.430
The fake rivalry, I think that's what this is.

01:06:01.191 --> 01:06:04.916
And they probably have been doing it since they were on the internet together, right?

01:06:04.976 --> 01:06:08.040
So what you need to see is that, oh yeah, we've been arguing for a year.

01:06:08.100 --> 01:06:09.001
That was all part of this.

01:06:09.983 --> 01:06:11.625
And so that was a slow roll, right?

01:06:11.685 --> 01:06:14.488
He could have, we should have done this like a year ago, but we didn't.

01:06:14.508 --> 01:06:16.069
Well, that's because it wasn't time.

01:06:16.950 --> 01:06:23.877
Now we're doing it because it's time, or now we're doing it because we've reached that time in the script, or that's how far we've bent the reed.

01:06:24.298 --> 01:06:27.841
I don't know what it is, but he says he's got a PhD in biological sciences.

01:06:27.901 --> 01:06:32.927
If you know anything about academia, that, I wasn't gonna go into that.

01:06:34.192 --> 01:06:36.754
And he was now a senior associate scientist at Janssen.

01:06:37.775 --> 01:06:43.339
The first thing is, let's see, you said, what do you most disagree with, Zuby asks.

01:06:44.000 --> 01:06:48.003
And he says, well, you've said that RNA is killing people, and I most disagree with that.

01:06:48.043 --> 01:06:51.926
So Zuby says, let's focus on the lies about the shot.

01:06:51.986 --> 01:06:53.927
That's basically what they're talking about.

01:06:53.947 --> 01:06:54.548
But then, then,

01:06:56.129 --> 01:06:58.091
courageously says, let's just back up.

01:06:58.131 --> 01:07:03.495
Let's first decide if we see eye to eye on how dangerous COVID was.

01:07:03.555 --> 01:07:17.325
So in order to have that discussion and ask that very important question, I went and looked at the data from the CDC and from other government sources and found an IFR for particular age groups.

01:07:19.372 --> 01:07:21.473
And now you're running in a hamster wheel.

01:07:21.513 --> 01:07:27.855
And now we're going to listen to them run in a hamster wheel about this for several minutes, because that's exactly what this is.

01:07:27.915 --> 01:07:33.717
We're already 40 miles away from asking a really relevant question with regard to saving our children.

01:07:36.107 --> 01:07:36.187
20 to 29, 0.002%.

01:07:36.247 --> 01:07:36.707
From 30 to 39, I've got 0.11%.

01:07:36.747 --> 01:07:37.307
From 40 to 49, I've got 0.035%.

01:07:37.347 --> 01:07:38.748
From 50 to 59, I've got 0.123%.

01:07:38.788 --> 01:07:39.788
And from 60 to 69, I've got 0.506%.

01:07:39.828 --> 01:07:41.589
And then from age 70 upwards, it increases over 1%.

01:07:54.514 --> 01:07:59.058
First thing I want to say, do those numbers align with your own sources?

01:07:59.458 --> 01:08:02.000
So is that the infection fatality rate or is that the case fatality rate?

01:08:02.260 --> 01:08:03.982
I have that as the IFR, the infection fatality rate.

01:08:04.882 --> 01:08:05.022
OK.

01:08:05.102 --> 01:08:08.545
So I would look at case fatality rate if I was going to look at any number.

01:08:08.565 --> 01:08:12.969
He's always going to be looking down because he has a notebook in front of him.

01:08:15.270 --> 01:08:16.431
I never use notes.

01:08:16.511 --> 01:08:19.134
I've never used notes in a meeting.

01:08:19.194 --> 01:08:20.795
I've never used even an outline.

01:08:22.543 --> 01:08:27.369
In fact, I used more notes on my bicycle than I used when I do this stream.

01:08:28.010 --> 01:08:39.165
And that is an absolute truth because I used to put little tiny notes about what the figure titles were on the bar of my bike so that if I was riding and I needed to remind myself where I was, I knew the titles of the figures.

01:08:40.811 --> 01:08:41.532
That's my trick.

01:08:42.393 --> 01:08:46.157
That's why I could remember all the figures in a paper, because I actually had them listed.

01:08:46.257 --> 01:08:47.399
And I don't do that here.

01:08:48.080 --> 01:08:50.202
Obviously, I have slides and stuff like that.

01:08:50.703 --> 01:08:52.425
But in an interview, I've never done it.

01:08:53.703 --> 01:08:57.084
In any of my presentations, I don't have notes about what I'm going to say.

01:08:57.124 --> 01:09:03.366
There are no notes on the slides because this is a show about what I know and what I've come to understand.

01:09:03.426 --> 01:09:06.847
And so when I'm trying to talk about that stuff, I don't need notes.

01:09:06.887 --> 01:09:08.087
I'm not lying about anything.

01:09:08.107 --> 01:09:09.567
I don't need to keep anything straight.

01:09:09.967 --> 01:09:19.390
If I put it out in the wrong order, it doesn't matter because these are all synergistic ideas that don't cancel each other out if they're presented in the wrong ideas, rather in the wrong order.

01:09:20.540 --> 01:09:38.255
That's what's extraordinary about every one of these little fake conversations, is that they have to be gone and done in a careful order and in a careful hierarchy so that the contradiction in terms of, wait, why were you arguing about that question 10 minutes ago if you're now talking about this?

01:09:38.615 --> 01:09:42.118
That's what happens if you do some of these lies in the wrong order.

01:09:44.929 --> 01:09:51.523
And when you're telling the truth, you don't need notes, you don't need to keep things straight because all of it is naturally synergistic.

01:09:51.584 --> 01:09:54.530
It all lines up because that's the truth.

01:09:55.292 --> 01:09:55.552
You see?

01:09:59.286 --> 01:09:59.906
that.

01:09:59.926 --> 01:10:02.548
But to be fair, those numbers sound like I'll just agree.

01:10:02.568 --> 01:10:02.728
Sure.

01:10:02.748 --> 01:10:05.009
They sound like in the ballpark of what the case fatality rate would be.

01:10:05.029 --> 01:10:07.511
But case fatality rate is a is a better metric to look at for that.

01:10:07.971 --> 01:10:09.292
But okay.

01:10:09.312 --> 01:10:10.332
So what's the question?

01:10:10.392 --> 01:10:13.814
Shall we write the question down just in case anybody is trying to do this?

01:10:13.894 --> 01:10:14.555
What's the question?

01:10:14.575 --> 01:10:16.556
I don't see anybody putting it in the chat, but that's all right.

01:10:17.016 --> 01:10:17.797
So what's better?

01:10:21.659 --> 01:10:22.139
IFR or CFR?

01:10:25.512 --> 01:10:43.653
And now if they're arguing about whether IFR or CFR is better, and somebody is not really confident about what those two are, or doesn't understand that infection fatality rate almost always has to be a model because they don't know who's all infected, whereas case fatality rate can be derived from real dead data.

01:10:45.695 --> 01:10:46.376
Interesting, right?

01:10:48.148 --> 01:10:49.769
They're not gonna talk about that at all.

01:10:49.829 --> 01:10:52.511
He's just saying that he thinks case fatality rate is better.

01:10:52.991 --> 01:10:55.092
And if he says why, I'll be surprised.

01:10:55.713 --> 01:10:59.695
Because if he says why, he will actually be helping people just a little bit.

01:11:00.814 --> 01:11:22.320
but still essentially getting them to accept the fundamental principle, which is what if you're arguing about how dangerous COVID is and whether we should talk about IFR or CFR, then you're not questioning the novel, the novel virus, right?

01:11:22.360 --> 01:11:24.081
You're not, you're not questioning it at all.

01:11:28.086 --> 01:11:42.078
And so is it dangerous for Zuby to get into an argument with the illustrious Mr. Dan Wilson about whether COVID, debating about how dangerous COVID is should be used, the IFR or the CFR?

01:11:43.900 --> 01:11:46.382
Wow, it's just awful when you see it now.

01:11:48.163 --> 01:11:50.786
I was gonna just say, would it be fair to say for people aged under 70, under 1%?

01:11:53.286 --> 01:11:59.730
Uh, pre vaccine, um, age under, it was around 1% non age adjusted.

01:12:00.090 --> 01:12:01.711
So, uh, pre vaccine.

01:12:01.811 --> 01:12:03.752
So below a certain age group, it was going to be below 1%.

01:12:03.792 --> 01:12:03.892
Yeah.

01:12:03.912 --> 01:12:04.032
Okay.

01:12:04.072 --> 01:12:04.232
Okay.

01:12:04.252 --> 01:12:05.433
All right.

01:12:05.453 --> 01:12:05.593
Cool.

01:12:05.633 --> 01:12:09.735
I just want to make sure that we're aligned on that because my, a lot of my thinking, not all of it.

01:12:10.256 --> 01:12:12.737
Oh, what was that on that?

01:12:12.757 --> 01:12:14.938
Because my, is that my thinking?

01:12:17.520 --> 01:12:17.920
Wait, what?

01:12:19.454 --> 01:12:19.874
Okay, all right, cool.

01:12:19.894 --> 01:12:23.258
I just want to make sure that we're aligned on that because my... Is that a lion?

01:12:24.559 --> 01:12:26.621
Is that right there a gold lion?

01:12:30.204 --> 01:12:31.266
I see a lot of lion.

01:12:31.286 --> 01:12:34.248
That looks like a lion to me.

01:12:36.290 --> 01:12:38.833
And I know other people that use lions as signals.

01:12:41.135 --> 01:12:43.858
Ooh, I don't like that necklace very much.

01:12:46.636 --> 01:12:56.805
A lot of my thinking – not all of it, but a lot of it is based off of the fact that I do not believe that for the vast majority of the population that COVID is a serious threat, or ever was.

01:12:57.406 --> 01:13:02.791
I've never made the claim that for elderly people or that for people with various comorbidities and so on that it isn't, and I know that there's exceptions to this.

01:13:02.851 --> 01:13:05.774
I know that there have been young people who have had a bad and rough time with it.

01:13:05.814 --> 01:13:06.534
I'm fully aware of that.

01:13:07.475 --> 01:13:08.195
claim that isn't the case.

01:13:08.596 --> 01:13:12.497
But when I look at the... I know there are young people who've had a rough time with it.

01:13:12.517 --> 01:13:14.138
I've never claimed that isn't the case.

01:13:14.178 --> 01:13:24.123
So we're really, really, really, really, really trying to make sure that we both agree that there was a virus.

01:13:24.163 --> 01:13:25.303
We're not questioning that.

01:13:25.363 --> 01:13:35.448
And don't you dare put me in that category of people that denies COVID or denies that people got sick or even denies that some young people had something very strange.

01:13:36.604 --> 01:13:38.409
Holy shit, it's obvious.

01:13:38.891 --> 01:13:39.673
Stop lying!

01:13:41.425 --> 01:13:42.846
overall response to it.

01:13:43.367 --> 01:14:00.201
I do not believe that the response, I'm talking about lockdowns, I'm talking about the various types of mandates, the rules and restrictions implemented in various countries, the coercion, the segregation, discrimination, all of the stuff that came out of it and all of the longterm, all of the ongoing effects that that's having in terms of the economy, in terms of civil liberties, in terms of people's mental and physical wellbeing, in terms of inflation and so on.

01:14:00.601 --> 01:14:01.462
Okay, he's a Leo.

01:14:01.782 --> 01:14:03.283
I just thought, it's okay.

01:14:03.884 --> 01:14:05.585
You know, I gotta give them something, right?

01:14:05.605 --> 01:14:10.189
So they can cut that clip out and say, look, Jonathan Cooley thinks all the lions are bad guys.

01:14:12.088 --> 01:14:13.790
I'm sure it's just he's just a Leo.

01:14:13.810 --> 01:14:16.313
I do not believe that it made sense.

01:14:16.553 --> 01:14:24.361
I would go as far as saying I believe that the impact of the policies has been and will be worse, in my opinion, than the impact of the disease itself.

01:14:24.461 --> 01:14:26.904
I also think that many of the policies themselves did not make sense.

01:14:26.924 --> 01:14:27.725
I know that you're a science guy.

01:14:27.785 --> 01:14:28.665
You're all about science.

01:14:29.006 --> 01:14:34.572
I think that many of the policies that were undertaken around the world were illogical, let alone like

01:14:35.112 --> 01:14:37.034
they didn't make any sense in terms of science.

01:14:37.194 --> 01:14:40.756
So if you're willing to, if you're able to change my mind on some of those, I'm happy to give examples.

01:14:41.237 --> 01:14:43.879
If you feel differently on those, I'm not going to make you defend every stupid policy.

01:14:43.959 --> 01:14:48.442
If we want to go through some of them, we can see the ones that you think make sense and the ones that perhaps you don't think do.

01:14:48.762 --> 01:14:50.323
But I'm giving you my overall perspective.

01:14:50.643 --> 01:14:56.548
It looks like he's also taking notes, which I think if you're in an interview, that's not silly.

01:14:56.588 --> 01:14:57.548
And I've done that before.

01:14:58.149 --> 01:14:59.029
It is generally one of

01:14:59.932 --> 01:15:00.632
is generally one of choice.

01:15:01.172 --> 01:15:04.693
So if someone I've never in my life told anyone to I've never even asked anyone to back status.

01:15:04.713 --> 01:15:08.114
I've never once yelled at anyone for wearing a mask or not wearing a mask for taking a shot or not taking a shot.

01:15:08.415 --> 01:15:10.315
My stance has always been this should be up to people.

01:15:10.495 --> 01:15:12.976
And so he's it should be up to people.

01:15:13.096 --> 01:15:16.177
So even if the vaccine schedule in America is criminal,

01:15:17.017 --> 01:15:36.793
Even if the liability shield is criminal and has resulted in thousands of people being injured and maybe even thousands of people being killed, it's probably millions of people are injured and have no idea where their allergies come from, where their ailments come from, when in reality, some of them may be from their vaccines.

01:15:39.039 --> 01:15:40.801
That's the reality that we have here.

01:15:40.861 --> 01:15:44.664
And these people do not want to meaningfully question that at all.

01:15:44.724 --> 01:15:47.327
They just want you to have a choice of whether you do it or not.

01:15:48.888 --> 01:15:51.751
So essentially it's allowing people to be murdered.

01:15:52.672 --> 01:15:58.297
Imagine if you said that, well, when people go to the hospital, they're being murdered, but I'm not going to tell anybody to go, not go there.

01:15:58.717 --> 01:16:04.803
I'm not going to stop anybody from going to a hospital, but I do know that they're murdered when they go there.

01:16:06.095 --> 01:16:08.977
What a weird stance to take.

01:16:09.958 --> 01:16:21.727
It was part of the reason why my review got delayed for so long, because I kept wanting to say that it's killing people, but my co-author wanted to be a little more subtle and use a little bit more language.

01:16:21.767 --> 01:16:24.309
That's why we came to the language pause.

01:16:25.369 --> 01:16:27.651
Because I just wanted to say, stop all transfections.

01:16:30.733 --> 01:16:32.635
Which I'm now saying, of course, for many years.

01:16:34.161 --> 01:16:36.342
He's never told anybody to stop.

01:16:36.382 --> 01:16:40.204
He's never suggested that the previous vaccine schedule is bad.

01:16:40.244 --> 01:16:42.826
I mean, I just want everybody to make their choice.

01:16:43.346 --> 01:16:46.268
I don't want anybody to think that abortion is good or bad.

01:16:46.308 --> 01:16:48.009
I just want everybody to have the choice.

01:16:50.690 --> 01:17:01.176
Once you see that a lot of these positions are abdicating the moral responsibility of the question at hand, you start to see what they've done to us.

01:17:02.697 --> 01:17:04.699
I don't have anything against trans people.

01:17:04.719 --> 01:17:07.242
Well, then you obviously don't have anything against trans kids.

01:17:07.362 --> 01:17:08.864
No, that's not the same thing.

01:17:12.645 --> 01:17:16.967
And that's the same kind of cognitive dissonance that's being created right here.

01:17:17.007 --> 01:17:34.597
In fact, reinforced with an illusion of consensus that these two guys are creating, that they're agreeing that this is a useful conversation, that they're trying their best to come to have a objective conversation with one another, and they are absolutely not doing that.

01:17:34.918 --> 01:17:36.318
Stop lying!

01:17:36.919 --> 01:17:40.301
This is a performance complete with planted

01:17:42.287 --> 01:17:45.571
references and planted commercials the whole nine yards.

01:17:47.031 --> 01:17:56.173
if individuals do their own risk calculation for themselves and their family, and they think that it's best to stay home, or they think it's best to close down their business, or they think it's best to wear a mask, or wear two masks, or take zero shots, one shot, five shots.

01:17:56.433 --> 01:18:00.734
However many, I've never cared about any of that stuff before with any other illness and with most health things in general.

01:18:00.935 --> 01:18:01.975
I think it's up to individuals.

01:18:02.995 --> 01:18:03.555
That's been my stance.

01:18:03.595 --> 01:18:04.795
My stance has been anti-mandate.

01:18:04.896 --> 01:18:05.596
You could call it anti-mandate.

01:18:05.616 --> 01:18:06.436
You could call it anti-lockdown.

01:18:06.776 --> 01:18:10.997
I would simply say that it's pro-freedom, pro-civil liberties, and it's also just pro-transparency of information.

01:18:11.037 --> 01:18:14.558
One of my biggest beefs throughout this whole thing has been something- I'm anti-harm.

01:18:15.464 --> 01:18:17.348
Okay, that's the thing with me.

01:18:17.508 --> 01:18:20.253
And I think that's the message that these people all avoid.

01:18:20.614 --> 01:18:21.556
I just want freedom.

01:18:21.656 --> 01:18:22.418
I want freedom.

01:18:22.538 --> 01:18:23.279
I want freedom.

01:18:23.379 --> 01:18:25.884
No, I want safety from harm.

01:18:27.014 --> 01:18:33.815
Okay, I don't mean that I want rules and regulations and all this other stuff that people will automatically contort that as.

01:18:33.955 --> 01:18:36.036
No, I want crimes prosecuted.

01:18:36.596 --> 01:18:39.057
I want crimes actually prosecuted.

01:18:39.197 --> 01:18:45.918
And people were murdered and that was misconstrued as evidence of a spreading novel pathogen.

01:18:45.978 --> 01:18:49.959
And neither of these people is equipped to question that narrative.

01:18:49.999 --> 01:18:55.120
And in fact, I would argue that both of these people were given financial comfort

01:18:56.227 --> 01:19:19.357
and pre-programmed social media attention because they won't question it, because none of them are ever going to come to the conclusion that the previous vaccine schedule in America that currently still exists is actually far more diabolical than asking people to take a transfection that more than half of it was probably placebo.

01:19:22.432 --> 01:19:45.078
but that's why Jessica Rose is so sure this is so much worse and agrees wholeheartedly with somebody as crazy as Richard Fleming or Kevin McCairn or even Gerd von den Bosch, all of these people with disparate connections to the randomness of it's a gain of function spike protein in 2020 with certainty of a God.

01:19:47.419 --> 01:19:48.559
It's just ridiculous.

01:19:50.429 --> 01:20:16.089
Only now can it be seen because hindsight is 20-20 and when you look backwards and the behavior of all these people just kind of lines up like this it's not accidental if it goes all the way back to the beginning and With both of these people it goes all the way back to the beginning and it stays true to right now they were gonna talk about how the RNA was killing people and instead they decided to

01:20:16.897 --> 01:20:25.667
to take a detour into this nonsense, and we still haven't talked about how the RNA is killing people, even though that, in my mind, is a secondary message at this stage.

01:20:26.087 --> 01:20:32.694
The only reason why the RNA could kill or harm anyone is because they made up a story that justified the rollout.

01:20:34.136 --> 01:20:35.477
Stop lying!

01:20:39.230 --> 01:20:58.838
on earlier which is about the communication and I think that the communication has been has been awful and I think that the part of the reason it's been awful has been because I don't want to I don't even want to go too deep because I don't want to just like it could also be just a banana tree because when banana trees are small they look really a lot like that tons of stuff out here um but yeah I I do I do think that there are ulterior motives I don't think that the people who were

01:20:59.679 --> 01:21:02.100
See, so the people that are rolling it out are what he's talking about.

01:21:02.120 --> 01:21:03.081
So who are those people?

01:21:03.101 --> 01:21:06.562
I think that's going to be Pfizer and Moderna.

01:21:22.546 --> 01:21:24.788
It's not going to be the biosecurity state, right?

01:21:24.888 --> 01:21:37.959
It's not going to be the NIH and the NIAID and DARPA and DTRA and Health and Human Services and the entire executive branch that encompasses the State Department.

01:21:38.020 --> 01:21:39.241
It's not going to be all of these 17 plus

01:21:41.242 --> 01:21:47.506
intelligence operatives or intelligence agencies that are connected to all the Five Eyes countries around the world.

01:21:47.526 --> 01:21:48.726
It's not going to be any of those.

01:21:48.846 --> 01:21:54.609
It's going to be the profiteers and the people that had intellectual property like Tony Fauci.

01:21:54.629 --> 01:21:55.730
So he just wanted to get rich.

01:21:58.407 --> 01:22:15.254
And so the ulterior motives aren't going to be to teach a mythology to our children so that they can be enslaved by it forever for generations to come, and that that mythology is about RNA and free-range RNA being dangerous if you put the right combination of bases together.

01:22:16.775 --> 01:22:19.856
See how easy it is to talk about the truth when you know it?

01:22:20.706 --> 01:22:27.257
And how easy it is to see that these people are circumlocuting it with the widest margins all the time.

01:22:27.337 --> 01:22:31.023
Stay away, stay away from any useful questions at all.

01:22:32.694 --> 01:22:54.482
What one what question are they asking right now in mind and I'm not um, I'm not some super deep conspiracy theorist I'm not here like saying that I think you know The shots are turning people magnetic or if I G's out here gonna, you know kill everyone or everything like that I just don't think that in a remotely free society You should be forcing injections on people or you should be forcing masks on people Let alone children, but I don't think adults either and that has generally been my perspective I don't think that the government's even had a right to do many of the things that they have done.

01:22:54.722 --> 01:22:54.942
So I

01:22:55.242 --> 01:23:02.604
Okay, so they don't have any right to do it, and debating about whether the government has any right to do it ignores the fact that they lied about why they're doing it.

01:23:10.905 --> 01:23:22.688
And if the fact of why they're doing it is not real, but it's a cascade of lies about murder and fraud, maybe they murdered 10,000 people in New York and lied about

01:23:23.647 --> 01:23:25.987
another 15,000, maybe.

01:23:28.608 --> 01:23:33.109
We don't know because no one will ask the question except for Jessica, myself, and Mark.

01:23:34.809 --> 01:23:46.251
We don't know because people are too busy writing textbook reviews of virology as the textbooks teach it and claiming that that's enough to debunk what occurred to us.

01:23:47.991 --> 01:23:50.292
It's no different than arguing about IFR or CFR.

01:23:58.530 --> 01:23:58.890
A lot there.

01:23:59.190 --> 01:23:59.951
You're welcome to take that away.

01:23:59.971 --> 01:24:00.972
I'll allow you to respond.

01:24:00.992 --> 01:24:01.112
Yeah.

01:24:01.392 --> 01:24:01.732
That's a lot.

01:24:01.752 --> 01:24:06.795
So let's, I think first we'll start back at how dangerous is COVID, how much a threat was it and how much damage did it cause?

01:24:07.195 --> 01:24:12.359
So I think looking at an IFR, an infection fatality rate, is going to give you a significantly limited perspective.

01:24:12.619 --> 01:24:13.799
Are we still there?

01:24:14.480 --> 01:24:20.163
Because a infectious disease with a low fatality rate, but high infectious rate, can still cause a lot of damage.

01:24:20.544 --> 01:24:22.645
And remember that death is not the only bad outcome.

01:24:22.885 --> 01:24:23.906
Now, interesting, right?

01:24:23.946 --> 01:24:29.148
Because this is very similar to the argument that Kevin McCairn and Charles Rixey are making.

01:24:29.649 --> 01:24:34.792
The same argument that I've heard other people make with regard to an incapacitating agent.

01:24:36.232 --> 01:24:38.113
And so death isn't the worst thing.

01:24:38.213 --> 01:24:52.041
If it spreads really fast, like Charles Rixey said for three years, this was the most contagious virus in human history, spreading faster than anyone, anything had ever spread before.

01:24:53.359 --> 01:24:55.480
and it was because of the Fear and Cleavage site.

01:24:57.802 --> 01:25:00.624
It's a very, very succinct narrative.

01:25:00.744 --> 01:25:10.930
It's a very succinct set of claims that hasn't changed in four years, hasn't become a little better in four years, except for absorbing the term clone.

01:25:11.731 --> 01:25:21.037
At some point on a podcast with Kevin McCairn, Matt Crawford, and Charles Rixey, both of those guys admitted that clones are real.

01:25:22.145 --> 01:25:32.008
They just want you to believe that a clone, if constructed correctly, can be like a free-range RNA and go around the world consistently for five years and still be going around the world now.

01:25:36.129 --> 01:25:38.169
These people are challenging nothing.

01:25:38.189 --> 01:25:47.592
And in fact, Mr. Dan Wilson sounds an awful lot like he's about to say the biosecurity state has been developing incapacitating agents for years.

01:25:51.263 --> 01:25:55.709
He's regurgitating McCairn and Rixey talking points right now.

01:25:55.769 --> 01:25:57.792
That's the only thing to hear here.

01:25:59.793 --> 01:26:07.158
much of a threat it is because a infectious disease with a low fatality rate but high infectious rate can still cause a lot of damage.

01:26:07.558 --> 01:26:13.542
And remember that death is not the only bad outcome that we want to prevent in people when it comes to a new virus like SARS-CoV-2.

01:26:13.662 --> 01:26:14.343
Keep reading.

01:26:14.403 --> 01:26:14.983
You could die from it.

01:26:15.043 --> 01:26:15.464
Keep reading.

01:26:15.604 --> 01:26:16.544
You could also be hospitalized.

01:26:16.945 --> 01:26:18.986
He's got to look down every time he says something.

01:26:19.006 --> 01:26:19.466
Long COVID.

01:26:20.027 --> 01:26:21.848
None of those things are things that people want.

01:26:21.948 --> 01:26:24.470
And those are all things that we want to prevent in terms of public health.

01:26:25.190 --> 01:26:30.254
The more of those things we prevent, the more people live, the better the economy can do with more living, working people, et cetera, et cetera.

01:26:30.695 --> 01:26:33.577
So COVID did kill millions of people around the world.

01:26:34.858 --> 01:26:37.740
COVID did kill millions of people around the world.

01:26:38.381 --> 01:26:38.941
Narrative.

01:26:40.362 --> 01:26:40.642
Check.

01:26:41.519 --> 01:26:46.262
Majority of those people were older, but it did still have a significant effect on younger people.

01:26:46.943 --> 01:26:53.548
A significant effect on younger people that would never be misconstrued with other things that were killing young people.

01:26:53.568 --> 01:26:55.009
You know, like the opioid pandemic.

01:26:55.569 --> 01:27:00.393
The opioid epidemic would never be used as a way of saying that, look,

01:27:01.413 --> 01:27:04.036
life expectancy has gone down because of COVID.

01:27:04.216 --> 01:27:11.042
Oh wait, maybe it was because of the 500,000 people that aren't elderly that were killed by drug overdose.

01:27:11.082 --> 01:27:12.824
No, no, no, don't worry about those people.

01:27:12.864 --> 01:27:17.368
Why would we talk about a number as insignificant as 500,000 when COVID killed millions?

01:27:17.408 --> 01:27:18.368
When it comes to

01:27:22.739 --> 01:27:23.880
those younger ages and all ages, really.

01:27:24.440 --> 01:27:27.802
It's not so much a question of, what's the absolute risk that COVID poses to me?

01:27:27.822 --> 01:27:30.124
It's, what option am I better off taking?

01:27:30.844 --> 01:27:32.666
Am I better off with the vaccine or without the vaccine?

01:27:32.726 --> 01:27:35.728
Am I better off wearing a mask in certain situations or better off not doing so?

01:27:36.188 --> 01:27:41.832
And we can interrogate those questions with science and gather data to answer those questions.

01:27:43.112 --> 01:27:51.975
And so when it comes to things like vaccines, in all age groups, it's been shown that you are better off per capita being vaccinated than not being vaccinated for all of those bad outcomes.

01:27:52.936 --> 01:28:00.378
And I guess maybe the best example of this is that in Korea, for example, there's a really big data set from Korea.

01:28:01.639 --> 01:28:07.701
There was one study that looked at the adverse events and harmful effects of vaccines in a population of about 42 million people.

01:28:08.422 --> 01:28:10.224
I may be getting that number slightly wrong, but it was in that ballpark.

01:28:10.785 --> 01:28:15.069
And they even looked at deaths, deaths that can be associated with mRNA vaccines.

01:28:15.570 --> 01:28:20.335
And when it came to people 18 and under, zero people died that they could associate with the vaccine.

01:28:20.776 --> 01:28:28.164
However, in that same country, out of fewer COVID infections, so fewer than the 42 million vaccinees that I just talked about,

01:28:28.624 --> 01:28:34.046
Out of a cohort that's smaller than that, there were about 46 deaths in age 18 and under.

01:28:35.746 --> 01:28:37.327
Just to be clear, what time period is this over?

01:28:37.347 --> 01:28:38.527
Is this over the entire time period?

01:28:38.747 --> 01:28:39.407
The two and a half, three years?

01:28:39.427 --> 01:28:40.928
These time periods were similar time periods.

01:28:41.568 --> 01:28:44.209
I'd have to look at the papers to get you the exact times, and I can definitely do that for you.

01:28:44.509 --> 01:28:45.549
But there were similar time periods.

01:28:46.089 --> 01:28:50.651
And there were about 46 deaths in people aged 18 and under in that country from COVID.

01:28:51.211 --> 01:28:53.671
And the biggest risk factor for them was being not vaccinated.

01:28:55.672 --> 01:28:57.552
You see a data set like that, and that can give you a big picture perspective.

01:28:57.572 --> 01:29:00.153
But then we can also drill down to individual cohorts.

01:29:00.233 --> 01:29:03.334
We can do more detailed studies looking at it.

01:29:03.354 --> 01:29:07.895
Of course, now we're not asking any relevant questions here, like how did they define COVID?

01:29:07.935 --> 01:29:09.855
What tests did they use to define COVID?

01:29:09.875 --> 01:29:11.236
How rigorous were they about it?

01:29:11.856 --> 01:29:20.658
None of these things are going to be discussed because, again, we're just taking the assumptions of the papers that he mentions, of the papers that he mentions.

01:29:20.718 --> 01:29:21.298
It won't matter.

01:29:22.705 --> 01:29:25.367
Because this isn't a debate in earnest, ladies and gentlemen.

01:29:25.407 --> 01:29:37.655
Whether they are witting or unwittingly participating, they are participating in the limited spectrum of debate, and bouncing around inside of it as vigorously as they can, like two motorcycles in a cage going around like this.

01:29:39.497 --> 01:29:45.381
Wow, and now the cage is gonna rotate around, and it's just a wheel of death.

01:29:45.461 --> 01:29:51.065
But actually, they're not engaged in any meaningful discussion, and they're not putting themselves in danger at all.

01:29:52.984 --> 01:29:58.046
And it's just, it is exactly how they are going to trap our children.

01:29:58.106 --> 01:30:06.770
If our children are watching this on social media, if our college age kids are listening to Zuby on social media, this is what happens.

01:30:06.850 --> 01:30:13.934
And if they have enough Zubys and enough Dan Wilsons, then it doesn't matter if nobody follows any of these people because nobody follows me.

01:30:17.904 --> 01:30:18.544
from all over the world.

01:30:19.204 --> 01:30:20.985
Sorry to jump in there.

01:30:21.005 --> 01:30:27.246
Do you know what, out of those, let's say the 46 young people who you said died, was that of COVID directly from it?

01:30:28.286 --> 01:30:29.047
Yeah.

01:30:29.247 --> 01:30:32.687
Do you know what percentage of those had comorbidities versus not, just to be clear?

01:30:32.928 --> 01:30:34.668
So the biggest risk factor was being unvaccinated.

01:30:34.688 --> 01:30:35.748
Comorbidities.

01:30:36.088 --> 01:30:36.588
Oh, yes.

01:30:36.628 --> 01:30:43.110
We've got a debate about whether they had comorbidities, because then we can understand if they really died of COVID or if they just had COVID.

01:30:43.917 --> 01:30:48.561
Another terrible question that assumes that the test works.

01:30:48.721 --> 01:30:51.024
Assumes that if you used it twice, it would work.

01:30:51.064 --> 01:30:53.205
Or if you combined it with a rapid test, it would work.

01:30:53.606 --> 01:30:55.688
Or if you did it over several days, it would work.

01:30:57.249 --> 01:30:58.450
All lies.

01:30:58.730 --> 01:31:04.836
All irrelevant questions that are components, bars in a hamster wheel that you just...

01:31:12.182 --> 01:31:13.843
more of them were unvaccinated than had comorbidities.

01:31:15.543 --> 01:31:18.464
If you need to record anything, sorry, it's my Mac.

01:31:22.926 --> 01:31:24.506
More of them were unvaccinated than had comorbidities.

01:31:24.546 --> 01:31:25.046
Okay, that makes sense.

01:31:25.066 --> 01:31:25.366
I understand.

01:31:26.007 --> 01:31:26.127
Yeah.

01:31:26.667 --> 01:31:32.449
So when we look at all these different studies from around the world, we can consistently see that

01:31:33.191 --> 01:31:36.972
If you're vaccinated, you are less likely to suffer severe outcomes from COVID.

01:31:38.053 --> 01:31:39.473
And that's really the goal, right?

01:31:39.713 --> 01:31:41.434
You don't want to end up in the hospital.

01:31:41.454 --> 01:31:43.494
You don't want to end up with debilitating symptoms.

01:31:43.534 --> 01:31:43.874
Here he is.

01:31:44.295 --> 01:31:46.555
We didn't ever want to stop transmission.

01:31:46.595 --> 01:31:49.056
There's no stopping transmission with vaccines.

01:31:49.096 --> 01:31:51.017
Vaccines never stop transmission.

01:31:51.057 --> 01:31:51.657
Who said that?

01:31:51.777 --> 01:31:53.858
All vaccines don't stop transmission.

01:31:54.618 --> 01:32:01.120
They just reduce the danger of disease by exposing your immune system to something before it.

01:32:03.168 --> 01:32:12.817
I mean, think about how much they've backpedaled from 2020, where previously we have defeated all previous epidemics and diseases with vaccines.

01:32:13.257 --> 01:32:18.182
And that's why it's logical that for this new virus, we're also going to have vaccines in a couple of years.

01:32:20.014 --> 01:32:26.220
And now they've pivoted all the way to the stage where vaccines have never given you sterilizing immunity.

01:32:26.280 --> 01:32:29.923
Have we ever used the term sterilizing immunity?

01:32:29.983 --> 01:32:32.506
Gee, I can't remember I've ever used that term.

01:32:32.866 --> 01:32:34.247
Is it in a textbook somewhere?

01:32:34.267 --> 01:32:37.810
It can't be because vaccines don't do that.

01:32:38.151 --> 01:32:41.974
Even natural immunity, it's questionable whether they give you sterilizing.

01:32:42.455 --> 01:32:45.938
Sterilizing immunity suggests that there's a reason to be sterile.

01:32:47.734 --> 01:32:57.124
suggests that a clean epithelial surface with a sterile epithelial surface is the ideal immune condition.

01:32:57.824 --> 01:33:07.654
It's just all an elaborate system of hamster wheels that every time you think you're making progress you've just jumped into a new wheel or some

01:33:09.031 --> 01:33:13.735
Worse yet, some hamster has jumped into the wheel with you to convince you that this is the wheel to run in.

01:33:14.195 --> 01:33:14.996
Oh great, really?

01:33:15.236 --> 01:33:17.178
Alright, let's go, let's go, let's go!

01:33:21.013 --> 01:33:25.776
And it makes sense that you can prevent all those things with a vaccine that's giving you a piece of the virus, essentially.

01:33:25.856 --> 01:33:30.980
It's introducing your body to the virus, letting your body treat it as a punching bag, learn from it, get tactical information on the enemy.

01:33:31.100 --> 01:33:33.042
And then when it sees the enemy, it knows what to do.

01:33:33.622 --> 01:33:35.964
So again, we can see that for all age groups.

01:33:36.204 --> 01:33:43.249
And just scrolling down your page on Twitter or seeing the kinds of things you say about COVID vaccines, as a reader, I get the impression that you are saying that

01:33:43.909 --> 01:33:49.553
we don't need them, and they're harmful.

01:33:49.693 --> 01:33:53.295
I feel like that's a bit of a strong man of my position, to be honest.

01:33:54.135 --> 01:33:57.177
I was going to say, I'm not going to push back on all of these numbers.

01:33:57.197 --> 01:33:59.059
I haven't looked at the South Korean study and so on.

01:33:59.979 --> 01:34:01.000
I would make a couple of points on it.

01:34:01.220 --> 01:34:02.401
The first one that I would say is, look,

01:34:04.875 --> 01:34:06.455
46 young people dying.

01:34:06.855 --> 01:34:07.795
What's that age group, by the way?

01:34:07.815 --> 01:34:08.556
18 and under.

01:34:09.156 --> 01:34:10.897
18 and under, okay.

01:34:10.917 --> 01:34:13.357
In America, we had about... What was it in America?

01:34:13.757 --> 01:34:17.079
In America, it was about 2,000 kids throughout the whole pandemic, 18 and under.

01:34:17.359 --> 01:34:19.839
Okay, so 2,000 over a three-year period, is that fair to say?

01:34:20.760 --> 01:34:21.560
Yeah.

01:34:22.660 --> 01:34:24.661
Okay, but also mostly with comorbidities, right?

01:34:25.881 --> 01:34:26.101
No.

01:34:26.262 --> 01:34:27.102
Mostly not with comorbidities?

01:34:27.882 --> 01:34:40.835
Right, so there was a study that looked at hospitalization and ICU admission rates in children, COVID cases, and it found that about 30% did not have comorbidities.

01:34:41.055 --> 01:34:41.736
Am I still with you?

01:34:42.817 --> 01:34:43.838
Your screen's frozen a little bit.

01:34:45.248 --> 01:34:45.588
Okay, sorry.

01:34:45.768 --> 01:34:46.468
I don't know what happened there.

01:34:46.608 --> 01:34:47.028
Yeah, I'm back.

01:34:47.148 --> 01:34:47.389
Carry on.

01:34:48.069 --> 01:34:49.229
Oh, it's the deep state.

01:34:49.989 --> 01:34:51.790
They don't want this conversation to happen.

01:34:51.830 --> 01:34:52.970
It's so much of the kids.

01:34:53.150 --> 01:34:55.610
So much thought crime here had no comorbidities.

01:34:55.670 --> 01:34:55.951
That's 30%.

01:34:56.471 --> 01:34:59.251
But 90% of the kids admitted to the ICU were unvaccinated.

01:34:59.871 --> 01:35:04.753
So, you know, you can't always predict who's going to be at risk based on pre existing conditions.

01:35:05.413 --> 01:35:06.513
And, you know,

01:35:08.348 --> 01:35:12.332
About 30% of the kids that were studied had no comorbidities, that's 30%.

01:35:12.873 --> 01:35:18.238
But 90% of the kids admitted to the ICU were- 90% of the kids admitted to the ICU.

01:35:18.278 --> 01:35:20.640
This sounds like an imaginary place to me.

01:35:21.201 --> 01:35:24.384
Where were kids admitted into the ICU as COVID kids?

01:35:24.945 --> 01:35:26.606
What the hell are we talking about here?

01:35:26.646 --> 01:35:27.948
This is pretty extraordinary.

01:35:28.809 --> 01:35:29.209
Unvaccinated.

01:35:29.835 --> 01:35:34.739
So you can't always predict who is going to be at risk based on pre-existing conditions.

01:35:35.399 --> 01:35:38.702
And that's the important thing when it comes to public health.

01:35:38.722 --> 01:35:40.203
You don't know necessarily who's vulnerable.

01:35:40.223 --> 01:35:45.607
There have been plenty of healthy people, people who would consider themselves healthy to be seen as healthy, who have suffered of COVID and who have died of COVID.

01:35:46.068 --> 01:35:50.491
And if that suffering is preventable, then it's worth preventing that suffering with the tools that we have at our disposal.

01:35:51.312 --> 01:35:51.412
OK.

01:35:51.672 --> 01:35:52.172
That's interesting.

01:35:52.212 --> 01:35:53.634
I have many directions to go here.

01:35:56.417 --> 01:35:58.819
I think, okay, what's the first point I'd like to bring up here?

01:35:58.839 --> 01:36:07.768
I think the first point I want to bring up is I think that throughout this entire situation, one of the issues that I've certainly had with it is this is a real multivariate situation.

01:36:08.428 --> 01:36:12.973
And the sort of simplification that's been done through all the communication... Multivariate!

01:36:12.993 --> 01:36:17.197
See, this is the exact same thing that Bret Weinstein sells himself as.

01:36:17.697 --> 01:36:21.901
Because he's an evolutionary biologist, he understands complex systems.

01:36:22.322 --> 01:36:27.827
And a lot of people don't understand complex systems like an evolutionary biologist.

01:36:28.208 --> 01:36:36.236
And so since we come from an evolutionary perspective, we have very unique insight into a multivariate complex system.

01:36:36.954 --> 01:36:37.595
Stop lying!

01:36:38.135 --> 01:36:42.199
It's not very simple at all, or not very complex at all, actually.

01:36:42.259 --> 01:36:43.721
Vaccination is a lie.

01:36:43.881 --> 01:36:50.067
Intramuscular injection of any combination of substances with the intent of augmenting the immune system has always been dumb.

01:36:50.447 --> 01:36:55.052
Transfection and transformation in cell culture is RNA virology.

01:36:55.652 --> 01:37:01.478
And really, transfection and transformation were always criminally negligent if you were gonna call it investigational vaccine.

01:37:03.820 --> 01:37:04.981
It's pretty simple, really.

01:37:05.021 --> 01:37:19.636
It's not a multivariate system, unless you, a highly complex system, unless you believe that Brett Weinstein is right, and we're watching an RNA molecule free range itself for five years around the world because of its unique attributes.

01:37:21.838 --> 01:37:22.579
Stop lying!

01:37:23.200 --> 01:37:24.982
It's just incredible.

01:37:28.649 --> 01:37:29.991
public health officials from the public.

01:37:30.751 --> 01:37:41.323
And the sort of simplification that's been done through all the communication from the public health officials, from the politicians, people pushing policies, and so on, and from the media, even in terms of the way many of the statistics are done, has simply been unvaccinated versus vaccinated.

01:37:41.964 --> 01:37:48.771
Which, if you're talking about something as multivariate as health outcomes, is ridiculous to me, especially when you consider that the vast majority of people

01:37:49.432 --> 01:37:57.774
in the least vast majority of adults in our countries who got it, died, were overweight, obese, lots of, I know, I think a ridiculous proportion had vitamin D deficiency.

01:37:57.794 --> 01:37:59.954
So there are other factors that go into this.

01:38:00.314 --> 01:38:08.436
So I think even the simplification of just making it as vaccinated versus unvaccinated, not only did it lead to a lot of the divisive stuff, which obviously I take issue with, but I think it's also.

01:38:08.816 --> 01:38:15.597
And that's how you know that what happened with me and that that guy from France yesterday is not pro wrestling because I can't keep my, I can't do that.

01:38:16.357 --> 01:38:17.838
I don't know how to pro-wrestle like this.

01:38:18.658 --> 01:38:21.379
I could never have this conversation with Dan.

01:38:22.020 --> 01:38:31.644
It would never happen because the shit sandwich that he is serving up with some lipstick on it is really, it's just disgusting.

01:38:31.684 --> 01:38:35.186
And the fact of the matter is, is that he's not usefully pushing back at all.

01:38:36.684 --> 01:38:40.746
This is absolutely positively pro-wrestling in its finest form.

01:38:40.786 --> 01:38:47.189
It is a limited spectrum of debate that is an illusion of consensus created by these two guys that agree.

01:38:47.830 --> 01:38:51.952
We are trying and they are not trying.

01:38:52.012 --> 01:38:53.913
You are not witnessing anyone trying.

01:38:53.953 --> 01:39:02.197
You are witnessing two people in a covert agreement about what dumb questions we're gonna ask in front of these people.

01:39:03.120 --> 01:39:16.362
You have two people who have a witting or unwitting covert agreement to argue in a limited spectrum of debate in front of the people that they're currently arguing in front of.

01:39:16.422 --> 01:39:20.903
That's why they are promoted the way they are and not someone else.

01:39:22.783 --> 01:39:31.805
And if Zuby is not American and he's not American or has a dual, it doesn't matter if he's supported by Canadian money, whatever, it's all

01:39:32.932 --> 01:39:36.973
part of an elaborate attack on our Republic.

01:39:38.433 --> 01:39:50.936
It's all part of a way to get Americans not to pull their head out, not to ask the right questions, which will ultimately lead to their conclusion that the vaccine schedule in America is criminal.

01:39:52.216 --> 01:39:53.837
And it was before the pandemic.

01:39:54.877 --> 01:39:58.938
And a lot of people at ICANN and Children's Health Defense knew that.

01:39:59.915 --> 01:40:06.438
and assisted in a number of people being unable to convince others of that fact.

01:40:08.258 --> 01:40:09.459
That's the essential truth.

01:40:10.679 --> 01:40:20.963
And once we come to accept this, we will be able to move forward because we will be able to reject all of the people that are synchronously promoting the idea that we just want health freedom.

01:40:21.344 --> 01:40:23.785
We just want freedom of mandates.

01:40:24.065 --> 01:40:25.405
We just want free speech.

01:40:25.545 --> 01:40:29.187
No, I want people to stop being injured.

01:40:30.034 --> 01:40:31.575
I want people to stop dying.

01:40:31.635 --> 01:40:35.336
I want kids to stop being poisoned.

01:40:35.356 --> 01:40:36.117
That's what I want.

01:40:38.738 --> 01:40:49.382
And so I'm very willing to say that no one should be doing this anymore until we have some reckoning about it.

01:40:52.978 --> 01:41:02.975
It's a very large chasm of difference between what's going on here in this Kayfabe reaction, whatever this is, bullshit.

01:41:03.959 --> 01:41:05.159
and what I'm trying to do.

01:41:05.699 --> 01:41:26.264
It's very similar to what a lot of these mouse accounts on Twitter are trying to do, to create these very vigorous arguments about stuff that doesn't matter so that Americans will never reach a threshold where they come to the conclusion across the board, has common knowledge that holy shit, these people have been lying to us for decades.

01:41:26.304 --> 01:41:27.665
They lied to our parents.

01:41:31.605 --> 01:41:33.586
And the vaccine schedule in America is criminal.

01:41:37.168 --> 01:41:38.210
It's really simple.

01:41:38.270 --> 01:41:44.684
You can't even fill an hour podcast with the truth anymore because the truth can be so succinctly shared.

01:41:45.697 --> 01:41:52.880
I just don't think it's an honest, and again, if we're going to talk science, I don't think it's a very scientific approach to just say, okay, well, we've got a massively overweight and obese population.

01:41:53.040 --> 01:41:57.242
And most of the vast majority of the healthy people, whether they're Vaxxed or Unvaxxed or whatever, they're doing fine.

01:41:57.262 --> 01:42:00.143
But actually obesity is a gigantic risk factor to this thing.

01:42:00.163 --> 01:42:07.205
As far as I'm aware in the UK and in the US, I'm not sure if at any point it was suggested that people- Why do you think obesity might be a risk factor?

01:42:07.245 --> 01:42:10.727
Do you think obesity might be a risk factor because of this?

01:42:13.814 --> 01:42:19.795
Do you think obese people are working at 99% oxygen saturation all the time?

01:42:20.715 --> 01:42:29.017
What about smoking obese people, or diabetic obese people, or immobile obese people, or you hear me now?

01:42:30.157 --> 01:42:32.558
Oh, it was fat people who were vulnerable.

01:42:32.938 --> 01:42:38.179
Were they vulnerable to COVID or were they vulnerable to the pulse ox PSYOP?

01:42:41.140 --> 01:42:42.220
We should ask Pierre Corey.

01:42:43.356 --> 01:42:51.340
with vitamin D. I certainly don't know if it was recommended at any point that people get their butt to the gym, and they lose some weight, and they take care of their nutrition, and they do various other things that they can to boost immunity.

01:42:51.560 --> 01:42:53.921
It all just came down to mask facts, mask facts.

01:42:54.041 --> 01:42:58.604
And to me, as someone who is a health advocate, this is not a holistic health approach at all.

01:42:58.684 --> 01:43:04.487
And so this is where I think some of the so-called, quote unquote, conspiratorial thinking comes, because it's like, well, if this thing is simply just about health,

01:43:04.907 --> 01:43:05.887
There are a lot of questions here.

01:43:05.907 --> 01:43:06.708
Why are you shutting down gyms?

01:43:06.728 --> 01:43:07.688
Why are you shutting down public parks?

01:43:07.708 --> 01:43:08.508
Why are you shutting down beaches?

01:43:08.528 --> 01:43:11.209
Why are you telling people not to go outside and not to get that vitamin D?

01:43:11.229 --> 01:43:15.270
Why are you telling people just to put on a mask and take the vaccine, but you're not encouraging them to lose weight?

01:43:15.290 --> 01:43:20.632
You've got people who are 1,500, 200 pounds overweight, and there's no messaging at all, even suggesting them.

01:43:20.652 --> 01:43:26.113
And again, this is over a long period of time, suggesting, hey, these are other things that you can do to improve your health.

01:43:26.453 --> 01:43:28.254
So what are your thoughts on that?

01:43:29.571 --> 01:43:30.652
Yeah, so I'd push back on.

01:43:30.792 --> 01:43:33.234
So we are, where are we in this talk now?

01:43:33.294 --> 01:43:39.279
We are 25 minutes in and we still haven't really discussed that the RNA vaccines are killing people.

01:43:39.339 --> 01:43:41.560
The RNA transfections are killing people.

01:43:41.640 --> 01:43:46.084
The RNA and DNA are killing people.

01:43:46.104 --> 01:43:47.305
We haven't even gotten there yet.

01:43:47.345 --> 01:43:56.512
We're still talking about COVID and the measures and COVID and the measures and agreeing, both of them are agreeing that there's something to talk about there.

01:43:59.858 --> 01:44:02.099
Stop lying!

01:44:02.860 --> 01:44:05.281
So I wrote down comorbidities.

01:44:05.301 --> 01:44:06.762
So let me just clarify that.

01:44:06.983 --> 01:44:14.047
So I think that a lot of people hear comorbidities, and they think things like diabetes, obesity, asthma, things like that.

01:44:15.768 --> 01:44:22.832
And when you hear that people who died of COVID-19 on average had three or four comorbidities, I mean, that's been said a lot, like on Joe Rogan and things like that.

01:44:24.113 --> 01:44:28.274
but that's not really, I think that misses what a comorbidity is when it comes to a death certificate.

01:44:28.574 --> 01:44:32.976
So a comorbidity on a death certificate is anything that contributed to the death.

01:44:33.376 --> 01:44:37.057
So a typical COVID-19 death certificate might look something like respiratory failure.

01:44:37.717 --> 01:44:51.901
They are actually debating how death certificates are formed and how they're filled out and how the causes of death are prioritized when there are actually probably hundreds of thousands of different patterns of

01:44:52.401 --> 01:45:02.607
and death certificates being filled out depending on who's doing it and what office is checking them or approving them or filing them, what county they're in, what state they're in.

01:45:03.128 --> 01:45:15.135
And so here we are again getting to incredible detail with incredible certainty about a question that has absolutely no relevance at all to freeing our children from this problem.

01:45:16.075 --> 01:45:18.958
to pneumonia due to COVID-19.

01:45:19.559 --> 01:45:23.643
That's at least- The date on this video is yesterday, God darn it.

01:45:23.783 --> 01:45:24.684
It's yesterday.

01:45:24.824 --> 01:45:26.986
It happened 24 hours ago.

01:45:28.027 --> 01:45:30.349
Morbidities contributing to COVID-19, but they were caused by COVID.

01:45:30.930 --> 01:45:36.035
So the actual numbers on how many people were obese- It's almost like we haven't come anywhere since 2021.

01:45:38.427 --> 01:45:46.513
We could have had this conversation in 2020 if we really wanted to, because we could have discussed what happened in New York and said, what's going on?

01:45:46.553 --> 01:45:47.254
But we didn't.

01:45:49.796 --> 01:46:05.829
And interestingly enough, he and he are both unprepared to look at anomalies, or this guy isn't even sophisticated enough to have noticed that Jessica Hockett has been screaming from the rooftops about a particular American anomaly for more than three years.

01:46:07.102 --> 01:46:11.369
Holy balls what's going on here other than an elaborate hoax.

01:46:15.695 --> 01:46:18.139
These two guys probably both work for Peter Thiel.

01:46:19.722 --> 01:46:45.571
might be inflated in if you are thinking about comorbidities in just that in a way that says that they're just those things right so I could get you real I could get you the numbers from America on that breakdown how many people died from COVID who were obese had diabetes etc let's just see if we assume that YouTube let's give YouTube the benefit of the doubt and say they're not lying then 2,500 people have already seen it

01:46:46.932 --> 01:46:50.215
And he has 254,000 subscribers, okay?

01:46:50.255 --> 01:46:56.241
So, it's gonna be a hell of a lot more people potentially seeing it than will ever see anything that I do.

01:46:58.249 --> 01:47:00.451
And that's not by accident, right?

01:47:00.491 --> 01:47:03.712
That's programmed in there and he's got a million followers on Twitter.

01:47:03.732 --> 01:47:04.713
So this is a pretty big deal.

01:47:05.433 --> 01:47:13.918
Lots of people don't subscribe to YouTube channels that they watch because the YouTube algorithm is very good at giving you what you watched last time or the next thing from it.

01:47:14.618 --> 01:47:17.840
And so you don't need to subscribe to see the same people in your feed on YouTube.

01:47:17.880 --> 01:47:24.144
And so it's not strange that he only has 256,000 subscribers on YouTube, but a million followers elsewhere.

01:47:25.124 --> 01:47:39.097
The number that I remember seeing, which I've just looked up very quickly, the thing that pops up first is from 2021, which I've seen something from 2022, and it's saying that over 75% of the people who are hospitalized were overweight or obese, and that's coming from the USA.

01:47:39.257 --> 01:47:40.899
That's from the NIH and the CDC.

01:47:41.980 --> 01:47:48.586
I know that 70% of the American population is overweight and obese, so that's not... If you add overweight to obesity, then that's broadening it a lot.

01:47:51.589 --> 01:47:53.530
But yeah, that's just one thing.

01:47:54.291 --> 01:48:00.655
Maybe comorbidities might be reframed a little bit if you look at what's actually classified as a comorbidity upon death.

01:48:01.156 --> 01:48:08.882
But then you also said vitamin D. There hasn't been any data suggesting that vitamin D supplements help fight COVID.

01:48:09.702 --> 01:48:18.489
There is a common misconception that there's a stat that's also commonly reported that most people who are hospitalized with COVID, when they test them, they have low vitamin D levels.

01:48:18.849 --> 01:48:20.790
And that is normally a result of COVID itself.

01:48:21.471 --> 01:48:27.634
There's an analogy here where it's like if you're a firefighter and you go to a fire, and you're like, holy shit, there's ash and smoke everywhere.

01:48:28.175 --> 01:48:30.096
Let me get rid of the smoke and the ash, and that'll solve the fire.

01:48:30.556 --> 01:48:32.417
Like, no, the fire is causing the smoke and the ash.

01:48:32.437 --> 01:48:34.499
And in this case, the smoke and the ash is a vitamin D deficiency.

01:48:34.539 --> 01:48:40.242
Because your body is fighting off a virus, you are getting into a state where you can become vitamin D deficient.

01:48:41.183 --> 01:48:42.223
So that's interesting.

01:48:42.263 --> 01:48:44.965
He's not going to provide any reasoning for that.

01:48:46.351 --> 01:48:49.114
Why would that cause vitamin D deficiency?

01:48:50.195 --> 01:48:52.999
That's a really weird stance to take.

01:48:53.059 --> 01:48:56.843
Is he going to tell you that vitamin D is an essential component of the immune system?

01:48:57.564 --> 01:49:02.650
And that it's an essential component of immune activation for a number of cellular cascades?

01:49:04.432 --> 01:49:04.932
Even one?

01:49:05.173 --> 01:49:06.614
Is he even going to say it's for one?

01:49:07.622 --> 01:49:11.546
There have been studies looking at, can we treat COVID using vitamin D?

01:49:11.606 --> 01:49:15.369
Once someone comes into the hospital and they're vitamin D deficient and they're hypoxic, can you treat them with vitamin D?

01:49:15.389 --> 01:49:15.810
And you can't.

01:49:15.850 --> 01:49:16.230
It doesn't work.

01:49:17.291 --> 01:49:20.574
Doctors have tried it, because doctors honestly want their patients to.

01:49:20.694 --> 01:49:24.037
Just to jump in here, though, isn't it well-known, isn't it scientifically established that vitamin D

01:49:25.078 --> 01:49:28.099
that vitamin D in general is very good for your immune system.

01:49:28.139 --> 01:49:37.400
I mean, the fact that COVID itself, that the virus itself can deplete your vitamin D levels, that would suggest that as a preventive measure, it would be important to have those topped up either just from natural sunlight or from some type of supplementation.

01:49:37.580 --> 01:49:38.921
I mean, soothe spider is right.

01:49:38.981 --> 01:49:46.362
Vitamin D, the reason why it's important is because it is the absolute central molecule in the regulation of calcium everywhere in the body.

01:49:47.162 --> 01:49:52.783
Vitamin D and calcium are intimately controlled by the parathyroid gland and the parathyroid hormone.

01:49:53.976 --> 01:50:02.681
And so endocrinology class for me was one of the best classes that I ever had as an undergraduate because I had a teacher by the name of Dolores McWinney.

01:50:03.973 --> 01:50:08.895
Dolores McWinney was the scariest biological professor you could ever have.

01:50:09.755 --> 01:50:19.239
She had all of this knowledge in her head, and she would do the overhead writing with the scrolling page on the overhead, and you just took notes.

01:50:19.579 --> 01:50:25.641
And when you took a test, the test was derived from every line of notes that she ever talked.

01:50:27.242 --> 01:50:32.064
The tests were gigantic, and they tested every single point.

01:50:33.616 --> 01:50:41.101
And one thing that this woman made clear, if you look up Dolores McWinney on the internet, you will find a woman who has a twin.

01:50:42.142 --> 01:50:46.005
And her twin actually was the first woman to ever make it to the South Pole.

01:50:47.145 --> 01:50:55.371
And Dolores McWinney actually studied at Woods Hole in MIT around the same time that green fluorescent protein was found.

01:50:56.031 --> 01:50:58.093
And she was an absolute badass.

01:51:00.267 --> 01:51:11.474
And so I understand the central role of calcium regulation in almost all physiological metabolic chains and where vitamin D plays a giant role in that.

01:51:11.534 --> 01:51:17.738
So it does have a role in the immune system, but that's one of its absolutely almost countless roles.

01:51:19.999 --> 01:51:26.964
So here's to Soothspider for having the heads up to be able to tweets or to chat something like that.

01:51:27.671 --> 01:51:28.251
something there.

01:51:28.271 --> 01:51:31.734
Well, so if that were true, then if we give it back while your body's fighting COVID, then that should help.

01:51:31.854 --> 01:51:32.414
But it doesn't.

01:51:32.895 --> 01:51:34.976
And well, I think there's prevention versus cure are different, no?

01:51:34.996 --> 01:51:37.818
I mean, if you get someone to COVID, OK, I was going to say, I mean, you're obviously very pro-vax.

01:51:37.838 --> 01:51:42.902
And I'm saying, surely, if you gave someone the vax once they'd already succumbed to it and been hospitalized, would that?

01:51:43.202 --> 01:51:48.125
I doubt that would necessarily help them, even assuming that the vax is effective from your position.

01:51:48.386 --> 01:51:50.407
Yeah, no, that's not how vaccines work.

01:51:50.607 --> 01:51:51.788
And you're right.

01:51:51.808 --> 01:51:52.669
I see what you're trying to say.

01:51:52.969 --> 01:51:55.691
But also, that's not how vaccines work.

01:51:55.751 --> 01:51:56.832
I got to go back a little bit.

01:51:57.712 --> 01:51:59.073
while your body's fighting COVID, then that should help.

01:51:59.193 --> 01:51:59.773
But it doesn't.

01:52:00.393 --> 01:52:02.334
Well, I think prevention versus cure are different, no?

01:52:02.454 --> 01:52:03.574
I mean, if you gave someone a COVID, OK.

01:52:03.754 --> 01:52:05.175
I was going to say, I mean, you're obviously very pro-vax.

01:52:05.195 --> 01:52:15.478
And I'm saying, surely, if you gave someone the vax once they'd already succumbed to it and been hospitalized, I doubt that would necessarily help them, even assuming that the vax is effective from your position.

01:52:15.719 --> 01:52:16.279
Yeah, no.

01:52:16.699 --> 01:52:17.739
That's not how vaccines work.

01:52:17.939 --> 01:52:19.140
And you're right.

01:52:19.160 --> 01:52:20.020
And I see what you're trying to say.

01:52:20.320 --> 01:52:24.702
But also, there have been studies that look at what happens if you

01:52:25.502 --> 01:52:26.282
supplement with vitamin D?

01:52:26.802 --> 01:52:29.323
Does it help protect you against respiratory diseases?

01:52:29.383 --> 01:52:30.743
And the consensus is that no, it really doesn't.

01:52:31.523 --> 01:52:35.964
And the reason is that most people aren't actually very deficient in vitamin D to the point where it can be, excuse me, detrimental.

01:52:36.744 --> 01:52:53.468
A lot of times when, if you're not malnourished, then you shouldn't need vitamin D. And very few people, even if you're obese and you're- If you're not malnourished, you'll have fine vitamin D. But even obese people that only eat processed food or fast food, they got plenty of vitamin D.

01:52:53.948 --> 01:52:55.489
They never go outside in the sun.

01:52:56.090 --> 01:52:58.531
Sun doesn't have anything to do with vitamin D, does it, Dan?

01:52:59.552 --> 01:53:01.513
Eating well, you're probably not malnourished, right?

01:53:01.753 --> 01:53:07.277
There's a difference between not eating well and... Vitamin D deficiency is actually really common, especially in certain climates and areas.

01:53:07.737 --> 01:53:12.261
So maybe in climates where, like in the north, like in northern Europe.

01:53:12.521 --> 01:53:13.702
But why would it be there?

01:53:13.722 --> 01:53:15.503
Are you going to say that it's the sun or not?

01:53:15.563 --> 01:53:16.784
Because it is the sun.

01:53:17.830 --> 01:53:21.491
Vitamin D is converted to its active form by sun in the skin.

01:53:21.671 --> 01:53:23.332
There's not a lot of other ways to get it.

01:53:23.592 --> 01:53:24.592
It's kind of strange.

01:53:25.392 --> 01:53:27.593
That's the reason why they have a problem in the North.

01:53:27.653 --> 01:53:29.374
So if he doesn't say it, it'll be strange.

01:53:29.994 --> 01:53:37.316
Problem, but it's not really so common that it, it's not common to the point where it's going to put you at risk of infectious diseases.

01:53:37.756 --> 01:53:40.777
And that has been shown with these vitamin supplementation studies where they're actual.

01:53:40.797 --> 01:53:43.998
But it might not be infectious diseases that it makes you vulnerable to.

01:53:45.097 --> 01:53:46.600
You see what is extraordinary here?

01:53:46.620 --> 01:53:55.758
We're limiting the spectrum of debate to whether or not vitamin D can protect you from the outside invaders that we all agree are there, including this new one.

01:54:00.111 --> 01:54:02.372
control trials where people take vitamin D or don't.

01:54:02.853 --> 01:54:06.495
And the outcomes with respiratory illnesses are not significantly different.

01:54:07.395 --> 01:54:11.278
So yeah, I'm all for eating great, being healthy.

01:54:11.618 --> 01:54:15.660
And the advice on that has not changed from doctors in a really long time.

01:54:15.680 --> 01:54:17.781
Doctors have always said, eat well, get exercise.

01:54:19.908 --> 01:54:24.371
I hear your frustration because a lot of America does not follow good health habits.

01:54:25.011 --> 01:54:30.314
And yes, that can put them at risk of worse outcomes for infectious disease or just worse outcomes for health later in life.

01:54:31.675 --> 01:54:38.019
And, you know, like with your thing, I think it's great that you try to encourage people to work out and get fit and eat healthy.

01:54:38.339 --> 01:54:38.779
That's fantastic.

01:54:38.799 --> 01:54:39.100
That's great.

01:54:39.220 --> 01:54:43.022
Fauci actually said how many how much vitamin D he was taking.

01:54:43.142 --> 01:54:46.524
And he said it on Jennifer Garner's podcast in like 2020.

01:54:46.724 --> 01:54:48.185
And you're right.

01:54:50.307 --> 01:54:56.288
Like, you also don't have to give this impression that vaccines are not necessary or dangerous, or that they're dangerous.

01:54:56.828 --> 01:54:58.528
I don't, I don't, look, I'll be, I'll be honest.

01:54:58.548 --> 01:55:08.810
I mean, I think, I don't, I don't want to, I don't want to, what you're, what you're saying there seems a little accusatory, so I don't want to, I don't want to do the same back, but I don't think that, I feel like what you're saying there is sort of lumping me.

01:55:08.830 --> 01:55:13.691
I know you use the term, I've watched quite a lot of your YouTube videos, actually, and I noticed that you call a lot of people anti-vaxxers, you call a lot of people anti-science.

01:55:13.971 --> 01:55:18.912
I would say that I think you overuse that term to the point that you're kind of lumping in people who are genuinely against

01:55:19.392 --> 01:55:29.682
all vaccines with people who just have certain questions or who are skeptical or who just chose not to not to get this one or who have, you know, hesitations and things like that around it, which, from a communication standpoint, I don't I don't think it's very effective.

01:55:29.742 --> 01:55:33.706
And I know that I think a lot of genuine anti-vaxxers have actually been created over the last few years.

01:55:34.266 --> 01:55:37.507
partly because of the overuse of the term and just some of the communication.

01:55:37.768 --> 01:55:47.732
Oh, so we have some of these people who are really dug-in anti-vaxxers only because we weren't subtle enough or we didn't choose the right words.

01:55:48.152 --> 01:55:52.774
And otherwise, had we been more honest, we wouldn't have so many anti-vaxxers as we do now.

01:55:53.214 --> 01:55:53.995
Stop lying!

01:55:54.755 --> 01:55:56.056
Stop lying!

01:55:59.138 --> 01:56:18.705
I think when you kind of go around calling every single person who's skeptical an anti-vaxxer and just dismissing them, in my personal opinion, number one, I don't think it changes minds, but I think in the long term, when you look at the whole picture, I think it's actually quite likely to create more of them, because if people are just labeled instead of someone explaining a position, then I don't know, I think it causes- So essentially, anti-vaxxers are crazy.

01:56:19.878 --> 01:56:21.299
but we've created more of them.

01:56:21.339 --> 01:56:25.020
They're not disagreeing that anti-vax is a stupid position.

01:56:25.500 --> 01:56:30.622
It's just that we have unfortunately created many more of them because of the botched response.

01:56:31.063 --> 01:56:39.086
Can you not see how absolutely gigantic battleship-sized lie they are casting?

01:56:40.106 --> 01:56:43.948
It's an enchantment that's trapping millions of kids.

01:56:45.031 --> 01:56:52.103
And it's not just these guys, it's everybody that's performing this, just like Shannon Joy and Mary Holland do.

01:56:53.024 --> 01:56:58.113
Just like Shannon Joy, or sorry, Tommy and his guests do.

01:57:02.932 --> 01:57:13.019
just like Joe Rogan and his guests do, just like Jordan Peterson and his guests do, just like the nightly news and their guests do, just like the nightly talk shows and their guests do.

01:57:13.419 --> 01:57:23.166
It is an illusion of consensus about what the smart questions are and what the right arguments to participate in are and what the right stance to take on this or that is.

01:57:23.526 --> 01:57:25.407
You have already accepted the questions.

01:57:25.447 --> 01:57:31.011
And if you accept the questions and you're not asking your own questions, then you're not actually thinking.

01:57:35.106 --> 01:57:46.056
If you are only asking the questions that social media is asking, that you follow ask, or that you watch ask, then you're not asking questions yourself, which means you're not thinking.

01:57:48.098 --> 01:57:56.085
There's questions in our chat all day long because everybody that comes to this show is thinking and asking questions, even as I ask questions.

01:57:57.639 --> 01:57:59.322
That's what happens when you start thinking.

01:57:59.342 --> 01:58:07.935
You end up with more questions than you have answers, which is where we should be when we're confronting an irreducible complexity that deserves to be designated as sacred.

01:58:09.477 --> 01:58:12.322
Damn, I can rock this when these fools are this bad.

01:58:13.109 --> 01:58:16.172
and it causes people to dig in more and it creates more of a us versus them mentality.

01:58:16.492 --> 01:58:23.497
So I know I definitely through my communication, like I definitely have not been and I'm not pro, I'm not pro COVID facts, and I never have been, but I'm also not opposed to it.

01:58:23.557 --> 01:58:27.240
I know, I'd say probably most people I know, did take it.

01:58:27.981 --> 01:58:31.564
And I didn't tell any of them not to or discourage them or attack them or insult them or anything like that.

01:58:31.704 --> 01:58:34.527
He saved no one.

01:58:35.247 --> 01:58:38.150
He's so proud that he saved no one.

01:58:38.490 --> 01:58:46.397
He risked nothing to save anyone because he's not sure about anything, but he's sure that Dan is wrong.

01:58:47.298 --> 01:58:56.426
So in other words, they're extremely certain that everybody's confused, and they're extremely certain about why they're confused, which is just plain ridiculous.

01:58:57.810 --> 01:59:01.461
You can't be confused and simultaneously know exactly why you're confused.

01:59:01.481 --> 01:59:02.323
That doesn't work.

01:59:02.985 --> 01:59:03.688
Stop lying!

01:59:05.182 --> 01:59:05.482
to do that.

01:59:06.383 --> 01:59:08.284
But also, I'm very vehemently opposed to mandates.

01:59:08.324 --> 01:59:12.106
And I know, based on some of your older tweets, I don't know if you still hold this position.

01:59:13.226 --> 01:59:17.789
But I remember you saying something about being pro-vax but anti-mandate doesn't make sense.

01:59:17.809 --> 01:59:20.450
You didn't say this to me, but it was in response to somebody else.

01:59:20.730 --> 01:59:22.251
And I don't understand that position.

01:59:22.431 --> 01:59:24.132
I can dig up the tweet if you don't remember it.

01:59:24.673 --> 01:59:26.954
But it was someone who was saying that they're very pro-vax, but they're anti-mandate.

01:59:27.154 --> 01:59:30.436
And you'd suggested that that position doesn't make sense.

01:59:30.956 --> 01:59:32.097
Maybe you don't feel that way anymore.

01:59:32.437 --> 01:59:34.298
But that was something that, OK, go ahead.

01:59:34.878 --> 01:59:35.179
No, sure.

01:59:35.419 --> 01:59:37.902
I mean, so first I want to just talk about the anti-vax thing.

01:59:38.323 --> 01:59:49.477
I mean, so in my view, someone who is an anti-vaxxer is someone who uses their platform to spread anti-vaccine misinformation, whether that's about childhood vaccines or about COVID vaccines.

01:59:50.038 --> 01:59:50.879
That's my view of that.

01:59:51.619 --> 01:59:53.280
What does that mean, though?

01:59:53.320 --> 02:00:12.746
At this point, misinformation and disinformation and anti-vaxxer information, these are such egregious terms because they've been so overly utilized and weaponized by the media, by social media platforms, by YouTube, by certain politicians and bureaucrats around the world, where they just started calling everything and everyone who was not 100% on board with every policy in action an anti-vaxxer and started calling everything a misinformation, despite the fact that

02:00:13.266 --> 02:00:17.567
As I'm sure you will admit, if you're an honest man, they themselves have moved the goalposts a lot.

02:00:17.587 --> 02:00:30.390
They themselves moved the goalposts a lot throughout 2020 to 2023, and they themselves contradicted, I know science updates, I'm very aware of that, but at no point did they say, oh, we made a mistake, or we got this wrong, or okay, maybe this is not, these numbers are not what we thought they are, this is not what we predicted it is.

02:00:30.790 --> 02:00:32.830
They just kind of kept going as if it was still February 2020.

02:00:33.951 --> 02:00:35.111
So I would make the argument.

02:00:35.351 --> 02:00:38.952
So he would make an argument that is not that they've been lying since 2020.

02:00:41.024 --> 02:00:42.384
He's not going to make that argument.

02:00:42.424 --> 02:00:53.928
It's going to be very subtle and it's not going to challenge anything about what the national security status told us, which is extraordinarily on par for what I expect from somebody who's been on Joe Rogan more than once.

02:00:54.768 --> 02:01:05.852
So-called public health experts and the mainstream media and many politicians up to the president himself, I would say that they spread a lot of misinformation about the vaccine, about lockdowns, about mandates, about the virus itself.

02:01:06.312 --> 02:01:10.093
and how deadly it is and about what's going to happen to people who don't take the shot or what's going to even happen to people who do take the shot.

02:01:10.654 --> 02:01:13.354
Joe Biden himself, I'm not saying he's a, you know, but he is the president of the USA.

02:01:13.394 --> 02:01:15.275
He said, look, if you take these shots, you are not going to get the virus.

02:01:15.295 --> 02:01:15.815
You're not going to get it.

02:01:16.015 --> 02:01:16.716
He said that, right?

02:01:16.756 --> 02:01:18.016
Like that is misinformation.

02:01:18.216 --> 02:01:18.936
That's my point.

02:01:18.956 --> 02:01:19.857
I'm like, that is misinformation.

02:01:20.177 --> 02:01:22.838
And Trump, if you tell that to people, then yeah, exactly.

02:01:22.858 --> 02:01:25.679
I'm not even to me, it's not a Democrat, Republican thing, whatever.

02:01:25.799 --> 02:01:26.439
Oh, yeah.

02:01:26.499 --> 02:01:27.419
Trump was also bad.

02:01:27.479 --> 02:01:27.859
Here we go.

02:01:27.959 --> 02:01:29.240
Like that is misinformation.

02:01:29.580 --> 02:01:30.140
That's my point.

02:01:30.160 --> 02:01:31.080
I'm like, that is misinformation.

02:01:31.400 --> 02:01:32.661
And Trump, if you tell that to people,

02:01:33.081 --> 02:01:56.280
then yeah exactly i'm not even to me it's not a democrat republican thing whatever you know there's stuff that he says this and then he says that and so on and you know sometimes people get things wrong i have no problem with people getting things wrong and saying oh actually you know what i got that number i got that number wrong or i thought this was going to happen and it didn't or i thought that this had a 99 effectiveness and it turned out to be 80 or whatever it is and at no point did they they just didn't really update this um for a long time for a very long time i mean one thing that's annoying with the vaccine

02:01:56.600 --> 02:02:20.393
for me or the vaccines is the obviously the mandates and I do want to get into the mandates because that's that's a huge that's a huge thing that I'm I'm very opposed to but um it went from look if you take the shots you're not going to get it and you're not going to spread it that was that was how it started I remember very clearly you know you know late 2020 early 2021 that was the that was the message that was what you were telling millions just an anecdote um the way they got Trump to say the aquarium cleaner

02:02:21.073 --> 02:02:28.838
was in a private meeting, most likely what they did was they explained that they were testing a derivative of chloroquine called hydroxychloroquine.

02:02:29.899 --> 02:02:42.667
And so since chloroquine is much easier to remember than hydroxychloroquine, and they probably repeated it over and over again, it's a derivative of chloroquine, a derivative of chloroquine, and then they said once hydroxychloroquine.

02:02:43.028 --> 02:02:47.911
And then when he went out and tried to sound smart at a podium, he said the word that they wanted him to say.

02:02:49.997 --> 02:02:58.142
And then it only took one person to go out and do it or one report of somebody doing it for them to say that, look, now people are drinking aquarium cleaner because Trump's an idiot.

02:02:59.983 --> 02:03:01.584
Now I'm not saying Trump is bad or good.

02:03:01.624 --> 02:03:17.735
I'm saying Trump was used as part of a limited spectrum of debate where people that were thinking they were defending Trump from liars or thinking that they were defending their kids from Trump were more confused

02:03:19.164 --> 02:03:21.686
and became more certain about why they were confused.

02:03:21.726 --> 02:03:22.226
It's Trump.

02:03:22.267 --> 02:03:22.887
It's not Trump.

02:03:22.927 --> 02:03:24.108
It's them lying about Trump.

02:03:24.148 --> 02:03:36.698
And that, again, created a limited spectrum of debate that everybody could very vigorously engage in that would never free them from the original illusion, which there's a novel spreading pathogen, hair on fire, hair on fire.

02:03:37.338 --> 02:03:42.963
Pierre Kory says there was a huge thing happening in New York City, even though he arrived too late to notice it.

02:03:45.549 --> 02:03:46.610
of people, billions of people potentially.

02:03:47.530 --> 02:03:51.333
And then it changed to, oh, it's super effective, but there's these rare breakthrough cases.

02:03:51.693 --> 02:03:56.556
And then it started getting to the stage where tons and tons of people who were vaccinated started to contract the virus and test positive and so on.

02:03:56.837 --> 02:04:03.141
And then it shifted to, OK, well, if you take the shot, it's to reduce hospitalization and death.

02:04:03.661 --> 02:04:19.551
which is a very different statement to this is going to stop you getting the virus and prevent transmission like that's a very different that's a very very different statement and people obviously make this what an important thing to say here that actually if you're honest about it the current status of the narrative

02:04:20.430 --> 02:04:26.115
The narrative that's available on the social media platforms that he frequents is not this narrative.

02:04:26.555 --> 02:04:37.185
He could have made the argument that there are papers available that actually show, at least from the perspective of peer-reviewed science and p-values, that there are people being hurt by the shots.

02:04:38.006 --> 02:04:43.350
But Zuby isn't able to bring that up because I guess it wasn't time for him to incorporate that into his argument.

02:04:43.711 --> 02:04:46.153
Maybe that'll be an episode whatever comes after this.

02:04:47.301 --> 02:04:47.821
based on these statements.

02:04:47.841 --> 02:04:51.083
And these are coming out from the people who are supposed to be the experts, who are supposed to be the points of authority.

02:04:51.623 --> 02:04:58.627
And look, I don't know if they just got it wrong, and then they got new information, or if they were just being dishonest from the beginning.

02:04:58.907 --> 02:05:02.169
I have a natural inclination to lean more towards the latter based on the wider picture.

02:05:02.869 --> 02:05:05.471
But even without assuming malice, the point is that they still spread misinformation.

02:05:05.491 --> 02:05:10.433
So just coming back around to what I'm saying, this is why I think the sort of misinformation and disinformation terms are a problem.

02:05:10.553 --> 02:05:14.515
Because I think anyone who disagrees, right, there's going to be people who listen right now who disagree with you.

02:05:14.535 --> 02:05:15.656
And they're going to be like, oh, yep,

02:05:16.116 --> 02:05:17.617
Dan Wilson is spreading misinformation and disinformation.

02:05:17.637 --> 02:05:18.557
I'm sure you've had that in your comments.

02:05:18.597 --> 02:05:19.938
People telling you, you're spreading misinformation.

02:05:19.958 --> 02:05:20.758
I get people telling me I'm spreading.

02:05:21.078 --> 02:05:24.419
And it's just like, well, what does the term really mean?

02:05:24.640 --> 02:05:27.000
I generally try, especially on these podcasts, to not assume.

02:05:27.661 --> 02:05:28.881
I'm not assuming ill intention on your part.

02:05:29.201 --> 02:05:29.682
I know you're a father.

02:05:29.702 --> 02:05:30.222
I know you have children.

02:05:30.242 --> 02:05:31.042
I know you care about people.

02:05:31.062 --> 02:05:35.384
I'm not coming from the position of, oh, I think this guy wants people to die, or he's just on big formless payroll, whatever.

02:05:35.444 --> 02:05:38.205
I'm not assuming evil or ulterior motives on your part.

02:05:39.316 --> 02:05:48.244
But yeah, I don't want to ramble too long, but I genuinely wish over the past few years, regardless of people's individual positions, I wish there could have been a lot more of that.

02:05:48.424 --> 02:06:01.096
And I think part of the reason it got so contentious and unpleasant is because people were just so tribal that they were unwilling to say, OK, maybe this person is not an evil anti-vax conspiracy theorist who wants everybody to die and my grandma to die and my children to die or whatever.

02:06:01.116 --> 02:06:02.397
Maybe they just have a different opinion.

02:06:02.517 --> 02:06:06.798
Yeah, I remember what he's talking about here and keep in reference what happened yesterday.

02:06:06.898 --> 02:06:28.846
Somebody who on the stream live, very calmly admitted we probably agree about most stuff, also the day before decided to post a pretty lame rebuttal to what I said with a picture of myself in a crack pipe, probably cut by Kevin McCarran and Charles Rixey, and then came on my stream and tried to argue that those two guys are legitimate actors.

02:06:30.137 --> 02:06:54.115
legitimate actors whose understanding of the Incapacitating agent that was released on us and in 2020 hasn't changed at all in four years And so we're still here we're still fighting this and we are still coming up against the cage because again the way that they do it is that they just don't acknowledge that I'm here and

02:06:57.352 --> 02:07:00.996
Because otherwise, Jessica Rose and all these other people disappeared.

02:07:01.016 --> 02:07:03.358
Do you know how many of those people have been on my show?

02:07:05.460 --> 02:07:08.424
The only one that really hasn't been on my show is Robert Malone.

02:07:08.864 --> 02:07:09.525
Think about that.

02:07:11.226 --> 02:07:14.310
All the other ones showed up on my show, some of them multiple times.

02:07:15.350 --> 02:07:20.133
That's how long they've been meddling and trying to absorb Jonathan Cooley.

02:07:20.153 --> 02:07:21.694
You know, let's make him feel a part of this.

02:07:21.734 --> 02:07:22.874
Let's make him feel a part of that.

02:07:22.934 --> 02:07:25.756
Maybe we ought to invite him to Steve Kersh's steering committee.

02:07:26.176 --> 02:07:27.257
Then he'll feel smart.

02:07:27.357 --> 02:07:38.864
Once he's in a Zoom meeting with Mark Giraudeau and John Bodwin and Matt Crawford and Jessica Rose and Stephanie Seneff and Steve Kersh, he'll feel much better about where he is.

02:07:41.625 --> 02:07:42.306
Stop lying!

02:07:43.854 --> 02:07:46.161
That happened years ago already, ladies and gentlemen.

02:07:46.201 --> 02:07:47.505
That's how long I've been in it.

02:07:49.350 --> 02:07:50.012
The same the other way around.

02:07:50.728 --> 02:07:50.888
Sure.

02:07:51.408 --> 02:07:58.451
Yeah, so when I say the term anti-vaccine misinformation, that's not implying that the mass media or the president doesn't spread misinformation.

02:07:58.831 --> 02:08:15.938
I'm just saying that if someone is spreading anti-vaccine misinformation, in other words, saying things like vaccines have killed 17 million people, or COVID vaccines are gene therapies, or all this stuff, that is anti-vaccine misinformation.

02:08:16.238 --> 02:08:18.459
Didn't some of the manufacturers themselves use the term gene therapy?

02:08:19.059 --> 02:08:19.179
No.

02:08:19.399 --> 02:08:25.505
So they talked about how when mRNA vaccines were first, they were thinking about how to submit them to the FDA.

02:08:25.825 --> 02:08:35.954
There was no structure for the FDA to look at something, to review something, or categorize mRNA vaccines, because mRNA vaccines had not gone to market before COVID.

02:08:36.374 --> 02:08:48.893
so they were saying we can submit it as a gene therapy as if it's a gene therapy but it is not a gene therapy because it's not treating a genetic disease by i don't know exactly the details of why this is a lie but it's a lie simply because if he is

02:08:49.912 --> 02:09:04.935
the academic trained biologist that he claimed to be at the beginning of this, then there is no way he could not know that before the pandemic, using DNA to transform something like a cell culture would have been called transformation.

02:09:05.455 --> 02:09:10.976
And using RNA to transfect something like a cell culture would have been called transfection.

02:09:11.676 --> 02:09:18.357
And it's very likely in his study of ribosomal subunit function, he probably transfected

02:09:19.673 --> 02:09:27.017
his gene of interest or altered genes of interest into a cell culture and then studied the function of those ribosomes.

02:09:27.057 --> 02:09:31.299
So he knows that we don't need to call them gene therapies.

02:09:31.359 --> 02:09:34.200
They had names for two decades.

02:09:34.321 --> 02:09:36.522
And Kevin McKernan also knows that.

02:09:36.602 --> 02:09:46.107
Robert Malone, who spoke in front of the WHO and sold vaccine technologies and brokered them between nations, knows.

02:09:47.207 --> 02:09:48.448
Merrill Nass knows.

02:09:49.557 --> 02:09:52.158
Mary Holland knows, because I've told her in Zoom meetings.

02:09:53.318 --> 02:09:54.778
All of these people know.

02:09:55.938 --> 02:09:58.659
And if they don't say it at this point, it's because they're playing along.

02:09:59.439 --> 02:10:05.380
And if they're playing along, that means they're complicit in the murders that everybody's lying about and distorting as a lab leak.

02:10:06.601 --> 02:10:11.362
They're complicit in the murders that everybody is lying about and distorting as a lab leak.

02:10:11.442 --> 02:10:12.642
That's what these people are.

02:10:14.262 --> 02:10:17.823
And they're getting comfort and artificial social fame

02:10:19.235 --> 02:10:28.764
from conforming with this narrative and reinforcing it with a very skilled, limited spectrum of debate that the weaponized piles of money can trust them with.

02:10:28.824 --> 02:10:36.711
And so the more successfully they do it, the higher they will rise, the more financial gain they'll get, the more notoriety they'll have.

02:10:36.791 --> 02:10:38.653
Maybe they'll get a sponsor or something.

02:10:39.714 --> 02:10:40.995
Correcting a genetic deficiency.

02:10:44.750 --> 02:10:46.772
So yeah, that's what I mean when I say missing.

02:10:47.212 --> 02:10:48.833
And I don't think the shots have killed 17 million people.

02:10:48.854 --> 02:10:50.575
That sounds like a, yeah, that's overestimating.

02:10:50.815 --> 02:10:51.075
That's good.

02:10:51.496 --> 02:10:55.259
Oh, so he doesn't think that the shots have killed 17 million people.

02:10:55.299 --> 02:10:58.081
He disagrees with Denny Rancor.

02:10:58.141 --> 02:11:01.364
What an interesting stance to take.

02:11:01.384 --> 02:11:04.607
You're so brave for having taken that stance.

02:11:05.087 --> 02:11:07.289
I don't think they killed 17 million people.

02:11:07.329 --> 02:11:09.451
I think that's probably too high of a number.

02:11:10.171 --> 02:11:11.452
Stop lying!

02:11:14.960 --> 02:11:16.421
But there are people who do think that.

02:11:16.521 --> 02:11:21.485
And so when they say things like that, humans like to categorize things.

02:11:21.645 --> 02:11:24.627
And that is anti-vaccine misinformation to me.

02:11:25.108 --> 02:11:27.790
But again, that's not to say that the mainstream media can't spread misinformation.

02:11:27.810 --> 02:11:30.592
Like you said, Biden said, if you get COVID vaccines, you're not going to get COVID.

02:11:30.612 --> 02:11:31.272
You're not going to get sick.

02:11:31.633 --> 02:11:32.133
That was not true.

02:11:32.773 --> 02:11:36.256
Trump said that COVID vaccines saved, like, what did he say?

02:11:36.696 --> 02:11:37.897
He said, like, 100 million American lives.

02:11:37.917 --> 02:11:38.798
I mean, that's not true.

02:11:38.818 --> 02:11:39.318
That's ridiculous.

02:11:39.458 --> 02:11:39.939
That's way too high.

02:11:41.100 --> 02:11:45.064
And the thing is that politicians and news media outlets.

02:11:45.904 --> 02:11:49.948
So again, we're agreeing that arguing about the numbers is significant.

02:11:49.988 --> 02:11:51.470
They're actually coming to an agreement.

02:11:51.490 --> 02:11:54.032
Yeah, I also agree that the numbers are too high.

02:11:54.052 --> 02:11:57.396
And I also agree that they exaggerated how many people were saved from it.

02:11:57.856 --> 02:12:03.937
But they're not arguing about whether people died and they're not arguing about whether people were saved.

02:12:04.338 --> 02:12:11.099
They're just arguing about whether the numbers of people that died is right or the number of people that were saved were wrong.

02:12:13.660 --> 02:12:16.120
Boy, I'm getting tired of running in this hamster wheel.

02:12:16.180 --> 02:12:17.241
I got to keep going.

02:12:17.281 --> 02:12:18.101
Holy cow.

02:12:19.602 --> 02:12:21.764
themselves look good and news outlets want to sell stories.

02:12:22.325 --> 02:12:27.430
So politicians are going to embellish and stretch the truth to rely to make themselves look good.

02:12:27.950 --> 02:12:28.090
Right.

02:12:28.110 --> 02:12:29.432
Trump had Operation Warp Speed.

02:12:29.452 --> 02:12:31.373
So, of course, he's going to say they say 100 million lives.

02:12:31.393 --> 02:12:31.914
Look how great they are.

02:12:32.214 --> 02:12:35.517
And Biden, you know, they were rolling out mostly during his presidency.

02:12:35.537 --> 02:12:36.298
So, of course, he's going to say

02:12:37.339 --> 02:12:38.400
we're doing great, everything's fine.

02:12:39.140 --> 02:12:40.861
So, you know, I don't trust them.

02:12:40.941 --> 02:12:42.561
I don't look to them as good sources.

02:12:42.801 --> 02:12:43.602
And same with mainstream media.

02:12:43.622 --> 02:12:44.362
They want to sell stories.

02:12:44.422 --> 02:12:48.284
They want to either scare you or give you the give you like blow your mind with a headline.

02:12:48.664 --> 02:12:50.985
And so I don't take those sources of information seriously.

02:12:51.485 --> 02:12:52.866
Can I ask a question?

02:12:53.766 --> 02:13:14.062
sure just uh just based on what you just said there um how come you don't seem to have as much uh smoke for them as you do for the uh independent individuals and podcasters and things like that who are out there um actually having open conversations perhaps conversations you disagree with and would like to rebut i'm still i would think that the when i'm still having audio here you might have to refresh

02:13:15.555 --> 02:13:30.308
talking about power dynamics and influence, the mainstream media, the pharmaceutical companies, the CDC, the Fauci's and his equivalents around the world, the presidents and prime ministers, the people actually setting all of these policies and who are pushing out all this information en masse, and who have, you know, billions and trillions to do it with, if they are

02:13:31.630 --> 02:13:56.914
you can as you said if they've told lies and that they themselves have spread misinformation and disinformation why are you not as critical of them as you are of i don't know whether it's a joe rogan or it's a brett weinstein or it's perhaps myself or um you know independent people who are just honestly trying to work out what the heck is going on so who did he decide to list joe rogan brett weinstein and himself it's like he's part of the intellectual dark web or wants to be holy cow stop

02:13:59.076 --> 02:14:01.077
Right, so I do criticize them.

02:14:01.397 --> 02:14:03.538
I have criticized the CDC before.

02:14:04.359 --> 02:14:10.401
I've criticized the government's handling of lockdowns, multiple governments handling of lockdowns.

02:14:11.382 --> 02:14:19.386
But maybe you don't see that as much, and it isn't as prevalent on my channel, because I'm in this space where I'm combating anti-vaccine misinformation.

02:14:19.426 --> 02:14:24.288
I'm combating the kind of misinformation that would have sucked me in as a kid when I used to believe a ton of conspiracy theories.

02:14:25.228 --> 02:14:26.969
Would have sucked me in as a kid.

02:14:27.069 --> 02:14:41.134
And if you listen to any of his other interviews, like his interview on Twiv, which is fantastic, he claims to confess that he used to be a conspiracy theorist because YouTube convinced him that 9-11 was a conspiracy.

02:14:41.955 --> 02:14:47.477
But YouTube also saved him from going down another rabbit hole.

02:14:47.977 --> 02:14:53.539
And actually, that's why he so believes in his hobby.

02:14:54.693 --> 02:14:57.754
of having fun debunking anti-science.

02:14:59.454 --> 02:15:02.775
Because he himself used to be a conspiracy theorist.

02:15:02.835 --> 02:15:04.295
That's why you should believe him.

02:15:09.697 --> 02:15:13.878
He doesn't have enough life experience to know whether an adult is lying to him or not.

02:15:15.098 --> 02:15:16.879
That's the truth of most of these people.

02:15:18.079 --> 02:15:21.780
They don't have enough life experience to know when adults are lying to them.

02:15:23.598 --> 02:15:33.201
And they also don't have enough life experience to know when an adult doesn't know what they claim to know, which is a very different thing than lying.

02:15:34.742 --> 02:15:35.822
Let me repeat that again.

02:15:36.382 --> 02:15:46.766
The skill that I feel I have because of my childhood is that I know when adults are lying about something, but they don't know it.

02:15:48.066 --> 02:15:51.948
Or they are staying committed to a lie and they know it.

02:15:52.088 --> 02:15:52.768
I can see it.

02:15:53.797 --> 02:15:55.779
They're not just doing it for the first time.

02:15:57.721 --> 02:16:13.759
The reason why this podcast didn't happen until now is because it's taken these guys a long time to sharpen this limited spectrum of debate enough so that they could cross swords and know that nobody was gonna get hurt, that nobody was gonna open up a new wound.

02:16:14.804 --> 02:16:21.429
Cause you don't want to open up new wounds, you know, where you just say something like, you know, I think the American vaccine schedule is just criminal.

02:16:21.489 --> 02:16:22.370
It always has been.

02:16:22.630 --> 02:16:24.791
Ooh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

02:16:25.452 --> 02:16:26.312
Don't want to do that.

02:16:26.332 --> 02:16:29.515
Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, easy, easy there.

02:16:32.426 --> 02:16:44.591
I think it's egregious and harmful, especially when people like Joe Rogan will host someone like Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and he'll tell Joe Rogan that HIV doesn't cause AIDS, or there's a good case to be made that HIV doesn't cause AIDS.

02:16:45.071 --> 02:16:47.452
And Joe just sits there and nods his head like, yeah, wow, whoa, that's amazing.

02:16:47.492 --> 02:16:49.672
And I'm sitting there just thinking, this is insane.

02:16:49.752 --> 02:16:51.633
How many people are going to believe this?

02:16:51.953 --> 02:16:54.074
And if a lot of people believe this, this is going to be super harmful.

02:16:54.674 --> 02:16:57.315
I mean, my- Do you know- Oh, sorry.

02:16:57.715 --> 02:16:58.616
Let me not cut you off.

02:16:58.636 --> 02:16:59.096
Go ahead.

02:16:59.256 --> 02:17:00.597
I'll just going to tell a story.

02:17:02.117 --> 02:17:05.982
And this might be a little bit of a tangent, but I brought that up because I feel strongly about it.

02:17:06.542 --> 02:17:11.187
My dad's side of my family is from a small country in southern Africa called Eswatini, formerly known as Swaziland.

02:17:11.888 --> 02:17:14.171
And that is the most AIDS-afflicted country in the world.

02:17:15.252 --> 02:17:18.355
My granny, who just passed away about a year or two ago,

02:17:19.957 --> 02:17:33.710
Is Dan Wilson actually going to testify to the existence of the virus, HIV, because his dad comes from the most HIV-afflicted country in Africa?

02:17:33.790 --> 02:17:35.512
Are we really about to witness that?

02:17:35.572 --> 02:17:40.797
Because that, I'm afraid, is the most extraordinary place that this could have gone.

02:17:41.657 --> 02:17:44.200
That is just spectacular.

02:17:45.106 --> 02:17:45.967
It's a tangent.

02:17:46.588 --> 02:17:50.192
I didn't really mean to go there, but I've got this note on my page.

02:17:50.312 --> 02:17:51.733
Tell the story about my grandma.

02:17:52.614 --> 02:17:54.236
I didn't get to see her much since she was so far away.

02:17:54.276 --> 02:17:54.997
So then time is weird.

02:17:55.037 --> 02:18:00.423
So I don't remember exactly how long, how long ago it was now, but she had a farm where she raised a lot of AIDS orphans.

02:18:00.904 --> 02:18:03.246
There were a lot of orphans whose parents died from HIV AIDS.

02:18:03.847 --> 02:18:05.709
Um, and a lot of time is weird.

02:18:05.729 --> 02:18:06.790
So I don't remember exactly how long.

02:18:08.671 --> 02:18:10.612
I don't, I didn't get to see her much since she was so far away.

02:18:10.652 --> 02:18:11.372
So then time is weird.

02:18:11.412 --> 02:18:16.794
So I don't remember exactly how long, how long ago it was now, but she had a farm where she raised a lot of AIDS orphans.

02:18:17.274 --> 02:18:19.635
There were a lot of orphans whose parents died from HIV AIDS.

02:18:20.675 --> 02:18:27.277
And a lot of, there were so many deaths there, partly because the president of South Africa at one time, his name was Mbeki.

02:18:27.557 --> 02:18:31.358
He believed that the antiretroviral therapies used to keep

02:18:31.918 --> 02:18:35.600
people who are infected with HIV alive to like a normal lifespan were poison.

02:18:35.680 --> 02:18:36.140
He believed that.

02:18:36.521 --> 02:18:44.625
And so he didn't let a lot of citizens, or he didn't pay for the entry of antiretroviral therapy into South Africa.

02:18:45.025 --> 02:18:47.087
And as a result, there are a lot of AIDS cases now.

02:18:48.447 --> 02:18:52.490
And the reason he believed that is because of a virologist from

02:18:53.817 --> 02:19:00.859
I don't remember the university, it was in California, one of the UCs, and I'm not going to name him, but a virologist who Joe mentioned, who Robert Kennedy Jr.

02:19:00.879 --> 02:19:05.980
mentions and mentioned in the book, who was pretty much single-handedly responsible for pushing the idea that HIV doesn't cause AIDS.

02:19:06.160 --> 02:19:14.703
I wonder if it's Dewsburg, because I've got a really good friend named Dave Rasnick who wants to come on my show and talk exactly about how he came to the conclusion that AIDS wasn't real.

02:19:15.163 --> 02:19:18.644
I wonder if these people would appreciate a long discussion with Dave Rasnick.

02:19:19.642 --> 02:19:20.302
Shall we do that?

02:19:20.423 --> 02:19:21.683
I think we should do that soon.

02:19:22.324 --> 02:19:34.331
Because we're at the stage now where if Dan Wilson is gonna be the guy that testifies that, I'm sure there was an HIV because my daddy is from a place where my grand-grand died of it.

02:19:34.931 --> 02:19:36.012
Holy balls.

02:19:43.056 --> 02:19:50.498
someone go on a podcast that is the most listened to podcast in the world and just say those things that are easily demonstrated as false is really frustrating to me.

02:19:50.678 --> 02:19:53.719
Easily, easily demonstrated as false.

02:19:53.759 --> 02:19:57.840
Let me go get one book that says it's false and then I'll demonstrate it.

02:19:58.820 --> 02:20:06.782
This guy with so little biological experience on the bench that he has three years of experience of it.

02:20:07.990 --> 02:20:17.431
working on a very specific set of methodologies to study the subunit of a particular ribosome in a particular experimental methodology.

02:20:18.803 --> 02:20:29.390
has now branched out into understanding all of global politics and all of global public health as this fight against misinformation.

02:20:29.450 --> 02:20:37.595
And he considers himself one of the frontline workers in regards to the war on anti-science.

02:20:38.826 --> 02:20:41.828
in preventing people from falling down that same rabbit hole that I fell into once.

02:20:42.448 --> 02:20:45.010
So that is my, that's where I put my efforts.

02:20:45.570 --> 02:20:45.751
Okay.

02:20:46.311 --> 02:20:46.811
I understand that.

02:20:47.091 --> 02:20:48.472
Do you think that people should be censored?

02:20:48.693 --> 02:20:50.494
There was a lot of censorship going on over the last few years.

02:20:50.514 --> 02:20:55.537
Do you think that that is, and so let's not get into a discussion about the biology that he could never go into.

02:20:56.358 --> 02:20:58.079
Let's just talk about censorship.

02:20:58.639 --> 02:21:00.881
So should people be able to say bullshit

02:21:01.721 --> 02:21:03.462
Should people be able to say bullshit?

02:21:03.502 --> 02:21:04.582
Well, let's argue about that.

02:21:04.642 --> 02:21:06.503
I think we should argue about that for a while.

02:21:06.963 --> 02:21:08.564
I think we should sue people for it.

02:21:08.604 --> 02:21:13.346
I think we should raise millions of dollars to fight for free speech.

02:21:13.406 --> 02:21:17.968
I think we should support people like Elon Musk because he's definitely for free speech.

02:21:18.529 --> 02:21:20.469
My word.

02:21:22.350 --> 02:21:24.451
I never thought it would be this easy to keep my cool.

02:21:24.511 --> 02:21:25.752
It's just so ridiculous.

02:21:27.179 --> 02:21:31.881
I mean, I thought that they would, they would come close enough to the truth that I would get frustrated.

02:21:31.921 --> 02:21:36.683
But I mean, this is, this is, this is just like shooting fish in a barrel with no water.

02:21:38.824 --> 02:21:49.069
I am certain, absolutely certain that without any narration at all, anybody that's in this chat right now would be able to do the same thing that I'm doing, if not better in some regards.

02:21:51.598 --> 02:21:54.260
That's how magical of a place we are at.

02:21:54.380 --> 02:21:57.221
Just share this stream with anybody that needs to see it.

02:21:57.261 --> 02:22:10.569
And everybody that's watching it and everybody that watches it after it's live should put it in Zuby's Twitter feed, in Joe Rogan's Twitter feed, and in Debunk The Funk's Twitter feed.

02:22:12.450 --> 02:22:20.895
Because this is the World Wrestling Federation at its finest with regard to the mythology of pandemics.

02:22:22.990 --> 02:22:26.400
So far, zero useful questions have been asked.

02:22:27.239 --> 02:22:28.800
zero course of action.

02:22:29.300 --> 02:22:39.567
I think that social media has a responsibility to, uh, curate or at least do something, uh, on their platforms, not just let, uh, things run wild.

02:22:39.707 --> 02:22:55.318
I mean, we would hope that Zuby has done a tremendous amount of damage to his position because in reality, what looks like on social media, somebody who really knows what he thinks and is really certain about what needs to be said is actually not that at all.

02:22:55.398 --> 02:22:57.059
I've never said anything like that.

02:23:00.900 --> 02:23:03.841
He basically admitted that he never took a stance on anything.

02:23:03.881 --> 02:23:15.846
It's very similar to Alexandros Marinos and Brett Weinstein, who had a discussion on Brett Weinstein's Dark Horse podcast about during an emergency, you either have principles or you don't.

02:23:16.426 --> 02:23:24.029
And these people don't have principles because they don't take a stance on anything meaningful, especially murder.

02:23:26.414 --> 02:23:27.174
Stop lying!

02:23:27.194 --> 02:23:33.877
I hope I'm not driving anybody nuts by my multiple sounds.

02:23:34.557 --> 02:23:38.479
I agree that certain things should not be allowed on social media, and we just disagree on where the line is.

02:23:39.960 --> 02:23:41.160
You're shitting me.

02:23:41.200 --> 02:23:43.641
There's no way that Zuby's a PhD from Oxford.

02:23:43.681 --> 02:23:46.942
If that's the case, then I don't even know what I'm doing here.

02:23:47.022 --> 02:23:48.803
Then I should have started with that.

02:23:49.103 --> 02:23:50.424
Holy cow, is that true?

02:23:52.641 --> 02:23:53.382
I think something should be done.

02:23:53.843 --> 02:23:55.185
So do I agree with censorship?

02:23:55.205 --> 02:23:55.365
No.

02:23:55.986 --> 02:24:03.196
But I think that social media platforms can and should do what they think is right to not allow certain content on their platforms.

02:24:04.377 --> 02:24:22.555
I mean, given the nature of science itself and the way that things change, there can be and there have been things which are considered conspiracy theories or which are very much against the scientific consensus at any moment in time, whether we're talking about this previous pandemic or we're talking about things further in the past, which people absolutely wanted to censor or do censor.

02:24:22.595 --> 02:24:25.357
And then they turn out to be the truth or at least have some truth in them.

02:24:26.318 --> 02:24:38.224
don't you think that's somewhat dangerous to let the social media platforms decide what is, again, it comes back to the misinformation, disinformation thing, because there could be something that in April 2020, it was considered misinformation or disinformation or a conspiracy theory.

02:24:38.244 --> 02:24:43.606
And then two years later, it turns out, it turns out to be true or to have an element of truth to it.

02:24:43.626 --> 02:24:45.847
And there could be then something, you know, we're always learning more.

02:24:46.168 --> 02:24:47.248
I think that's the biggest issue.

02:24:48.028 --> 02:24:55.312
There's a lot of issues I take with censorship, obviously, I mean, there's just the civil liberties aspect of the free speech aspect, but also from a from a scientific perspective, and just human understanding, it's like,

02:25:01.232 --> 02:25:03.273
Okay, I think we're gonna probably break it pretty soon.

02:25:03.773 --> 02:25:06.495
I gotta go play some hoops to clear my mind of this nonsense.

02:25:07.295 --> 02:25:08.135
Everyone has their different opinions.

02:25:08.155 --> 02:25:10.857
Everyone has their different positions, perspectives, experiences, and so on.

02:25:11.277 --> 02:25:15.119
And one person's fact is another person's misinformation.

02:25:15.179 --> 02:25:17.540
One person's opinion is another person's disinformation.

02:25:18.000 --> 02:25:22.843
It's so messy that I'm personally of the opinion that what we are doing right now, this is the way to do it.

02:25:22.883 --> 02:25:25.844
So, you know, Joe Rogan- This is the way to do it.

02:25:26.184 --> 02:25:27.665
This is the way to do it.

02:25:27.925 --> 02:25:28.605
Stop lying!

02:25:29.226 --> 02:25:29.526
Stop!

02:25:30.992 --> 02:25:32.933
I don't think it's the way to do it, ladies and gentlemen.

02:25:32.993 --> 02:25:36.495
I think the way to do it is to be really, really, really simple.

02:25:36.575 --> 02:25:37.696
That's what I think we should do.

02:25:37.716 --> 02:25:40.418
I think we should be really, really simple.

02:25:40.518 --> 02:25:42.660
What we should do is something like this.

02:25:43.280 --> 02:25:44.201
We should just say,

02:25:45.342 --> 02:25:48.625
that we think that these people are responsible for misleading the young.

02:25:48.685 --> 02:26:07.985
I think we should say that these people have been put in place in order to curate a limited spectrum of debate, which will never usefully move forward the understanding of young people in the world, and will never usefully move forward the idea that the criminal vaccine schedule in America was indeed criminal before the pandemic.

02:26:08.700 --> 02:26:12.003
That's what these people are trying to save by misleading our children.

02:26:12.504 --> 02:26:15.566
And I am calling out names because these people are the ones.

02:26:16.067 --> 02:26:17.808
You can see it because they're always there.

02:26:17.848 --> 02:26:22.132
There's no reason for these people to be present at every COVID conference.

02:26:22.152 --> 02:26:30.200
There's no reason for these people to be present on so many of these podcasts unless it is that they are specifically there not to talk about, to make sure

02:26:30.680 --> 02:26:36.927
that the American public doesn't realize that there are at least three ways to say that these people are lying to us.

02:26:37.167 --> 02:26:43.153
One is to say intramuscular injection of any combination of substances with the intent of augmenting the immune system is dumb.

02:26:43.814 --> 02:26:48.960
Another way to say it would be that transfection in healthy humans was always criminally negligent even before the pandemic.

02:26:49.700 --> 02:26:52.243
and RNA cannot pandemic.

02:26:52.283 --> 02:26:54.246
These three things could be said in a different way.

02:26:54.266 --> 02:26:59.412
You could say weaponized piles of money have murdered people and gotten people to agree about it being a lab leak.

02:26:59.712 --> 02:27:04.758
You could also say that the old vaccine schedule is injuring and killing thousands each year.

02:27:05.158 --> 02:27:08.042
And you could also say we don't need to fear wild

02:27:08.702 --> 02:27:13.007
free-range RNA molecules and make the same point, but you know, whatever.

02:27:13.408 --> 02:27:18.674
Stop transfection in humans, ladies and gentlemen, because they are trying to eliminate the control group by any means necessary.

02:27:19.055 --> 02:27:24.802
I'm gonna go play some basketball with my boys, clear my mind a little bit, and prepare for tomorrow's show.

02:27:25.242 --> 02:27:26.122
Because that's what I do.

02:27:26.142 --> 02:27:27.963
Ladies and gentlemen, thank you very much.

02:27:27.983 --> 02:27:32.764
This has been GigaOM Biological, a high-resistance, low-noise information brief brought to you by a biologist.

02:27:33.185 --> 02:27:37.346
If you like the work that I'm doing, please go to GigaOM Biological and find a way to support it.

02:27:37.966 --> 02:27:49.910
Or, at the very bare minimum, share the stream by sharing stream.gigaom.bio, the Twitch channel, the Twitter stuff, whatever it takes, wherever you are, please help me out by spreading the word as far as you can.

02:27:50.290 --> 02:27:52.711
If you want to put this in Zuby's feed, that would be great.

02:27:52.791 --> 02:27:55.752
It's not like he's going to invite me on his podcast or anything like that.

02:27:56.212 --> 02:27:58.392
And ladies and gentlemen, we have these people to thank.

02:27:58.432 --> 02:28:00.113
And this is not an exhaustive list.

02:28:00.913 --> 02:28:07.675
So if your name is not on there and you're angry about it or upset about it or disappointed, please just email me.

02:28:07.715 --> 02:28:08.475
It's just me.

02:28:09.135 --> 02:28:12.336
And it's just an Excel sheet that needs a lot of cleanup.

02:28:12.416 --> 02:28:14.577
So I'm happy to fix it.

02:28:15.697 --> 02:28:19.581
You know, not everybody is filling in the right names and stuff, and so I gotta be careful.

02:28:19.621 --> 02:28:21.783
I don't want anybody to be exposed who doesn't want to be.

02:28:22.204 --> 02:28:28.270
And so I apologize as much as I can for that list not being as up-to-date as it can be.

02:28:28.890 --> 02:28:30.112
And I love you all very much.

02:28:30.172 --> 02:28:31.293
Thank you very much for joining me.

02:28:31.333 --> 02:28:32.114
I'll see you again tomorrow.